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Thread: My chapter has some tunnel vision going on

  1. #11
    ironnerd's Avatar
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    I took a shortcut and bought an incomplete kit. The previous builder did some darn nice work, but it sat for a while. It needs a few repairs, some sanding and re-varnishing, and new fabric.
    John P. Adams
    EAA 1379403
    Team Hi-Max (in process)
    If it flies and puts a smile on your face, it's the best plane in the world.

  2. #12
    robert l's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Airmutt View Post
    So where are you sourcing your wood? Aircraft Spruce, TEAM, local lumber yard. If local, would really like to know which one. Thanks. At this point in time I would really like to take over a project or find a rebuilder. Been hoping something nearby like a FlyBaby would show up but no joy there.
    Last time I checked there was a Fly Baby stored in a hanger at KCDN. I don't know anything at all about it though. I may go there tomorrow, I could ask.
    Bob

  3. #13
    Airmutt's Avatar
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    Sure, that would be awesome!!
    Dave Shaw
    EAA 67180 Lifetime
    Learn to Build, Build to Fly, Fly for Fun

  4. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Airmutt View Post
    So where are you sourcing your wood? Aircraft Spruce, TEAM, local lumber yard. If local, would really like to know which one. Thanks. At this point in time I would really like to take over a project or find a rebuilder. Been hoping something nearby like a FlyBaby would show up but no joy there.
    What happened to the FB's you had?

  5. #15
    Airmutt's Avatar
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    When we started building our place up in Wisconsin I let them go and bailed out of Calhoun. Not too mention the pressures of trying to finish the RERP program meant no time off. Then went to a couple of programs that took me offsite several weeks at a time. Just couldn’t justify them and a hangar at the time. Retirement solved most of those issues.
    Dave Shaw
    EAA 67180 Lifetime
    Learn to Build, Build to Fly, Fly for Fun

  6. #16
    cub builder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ironnerd View Post
    That is some really interesting information.

    Yeah... Van's makes up a large portion of home-builts. Like I said, they are nice planes, but they are not the end-all and be-all of the EAB community.

    Some of that has to do with Resale value. I know that a few people build RV's for themselves, but sell them shortly after completion. It would not shock me to learn that same applied to the Cubs and some of the others.

    You need to adjust your attitude about what you are hearing just a bit. The reason these folks all talk about RVs is that their only point of reference is the RV line, i.e., they don't know any better. To be perfectly honest, their building experience is somewhat limited in that they have worked from some excellent plans with little left to create for themselves. I often times find when talking to RV builders, many have very limited knowledge about aircraft construction and systems. Instead, they quote what was on the Van's plans and can't conceive of any other way to accomplish the task. That's not to say all RV builders are ignorant, but it is to say many have a very limited and myopic view of Amateur Built Aircraft in that they don't understand other types of construction. By taking a role in expanding discussions or programming in your chapter, you can help educate these folks and enrich their knowledge base. After all, they don't know what they don't know and won't discuss other types of construction until they know enough to relate to it.

    I currently own a RV that I bought wrecked, then rebuilt for myself. There is no denying it is a fine aircraft. But I have also built a wood and composite aircraft, and two tube, wood and fabric aircraft, all of which had sketchy plans that left a great deal to the imagination. I found that I got a lot more satisfaction from designing and creating for myself than I ever did by inserting tab A into slot B and pounding a specified rivet in to a pre-drilled hole.

  7. #17
    ironnerd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cub builder View Post
    You need to adjust your attitude about what you are hearing just a bit. The reason these folks all talk about RVs is that their only point of reference is the RV line, i.e., they don't know any better. To be perfectly honest, their building experience is somewhat limited in that they have worked from some excellent plans with little left to create for themselves. I often times find when talking to RV builders, many have very limited knowledge about aircraft construction and systems. Instead, they quote what was on the Van's plans and can't conceive of any other way to accomplish the task. That's not to say all RV builders are ignorant, but it is to say many have a very limited and myopic view of Amateur Built Aircraft in that they don't understand other types of construction. By taking a role in expanding discussions or programming in your chapter, you can help educate these folks and enrich their knowledge base. After all, they don't know what they don't know and won't discuss other types of construction until they know enough to relate to it.

    I currently own a RV that I bought wrecked, then rebuilt for myself. There is no denying it is a fine aircraft. But I have also built a wood and composite aircraft, and two tube, wood and fabric aircraft, all of which had sketchy plans that left a great deal to the imagination. I found that I got a lot more satisfaction from designing and creating for myself than I ever did by inserting tab A into slot B and pounding a specified rivet in to a pre-drilled hole.
    You make a good point. What I am hoping to do is open the minds of the RV drivers a bit to other planes. Right now the Pres is assisting with a Sling build - apparently the entire plane is wrong and the plans are inadequate. I had to chuckle at that. The Hi-Max I am building is basically blueprints and a page of "Assemble the Empennage", and I like it that way. While a MAX builder actually starts by building the fuselage and wing rib assembly jigs, the RV's come pre-cut, pre-drilled, and pre-formed with build manuals that resemble Ikea products. I also have to design an engine mount for a Hirth, since the plans only have drawings for Rotax (which is fair, I suppose).

    The problem is that inferring that a particular plane is not the best invites righteous furry from its supporters, so I must treat carefully.
    John P. Adams
    EAA 1379403
    Team Hi-Max (in process)
    If it flies and puts a smile on your face, it's the best plane in the world.

  8. #18
    Airmutt's Avatar
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    I’m a big advocate of the chapter program. Unfortunately not all chapters are created equal. I think a lot of chapters go thru phases over time. Some chapter issues are driven by the presence of one or more strong personalities. As a former chapter president I’ve heard others complain about their chapter only wanting to only fly Young Eagles or only do fly outs while others got left behind or just a bunch of grumpy old men reminiscing the good ole days. It’s easy to forget that your chapter may consist of the veteran pilot/builder to someone just getting interested in aviation. Chapter activities should have enough variation to keep folks coming back.
    Dave Shaw
    EAA 67180 Lifetime
    Learn to Build, Build to Fly, Fly for Fun

  9. #19
    cub builder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Airmutt View Post
    .... As a former chapter president I’ve heard others complain about their chapter only wanting to only fly Young Eagles or only do fly outs while others got left behind or just a bunch of grumpy old men reminiscing the good ole days. It’s easy to forget that your chapter may consist of the veteran pilot/builder to someone just getting interested in aviation. Chapter activities should have enough variation to keep folks coming back.
    When I was a chapter president, I was criticized for having too much technical and builder content in our meetings and not enough to satisfy members there aren't interested in building. You can't make everyone happy.

  10. #20
    ironnerd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cub builder View Post
    When I was a chapter president, I was criticized for having too much technical and builder content in our meetings and not enough to satisfy members there aren't interested in building. You can't make everyone happy.

    True. And that's kind of what brought me to begin this thread. Too much of any one topic is too much for any organization. All Van's, all the time is closing in on too much. I mean... the Rotorway was not as good as a Vans... apples <> oranges

    He just needs to open his horizons a little. We'll move him that way over time.
    John P. Adams
    EAA 1379403
    Team Hi-Max (in process)
    If it flies and puts a smile on your face, it's the best plane in the world.

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