They used to have "NO SMOKING" on the wristbands but they changed it to "SMOKING IN DESIGNATED AREAS". The stupid thing is that there's no indication *ANYWHERE* what a designated area is.
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They used to have "NO SMOKING" on the wristbands but they changed it to "SMOKING IN DESIGNATED AREAS". The stupid thing is that there's no indication *ANYWHERE* what a designated area is.
Yes, people were smoking everywhere. Each time I took my 7-yr old to the restrooms near the B-Bldg or C-Bldg you had to work your way through the fog of cigarette smoke. I'm not interested in my kid (or me) inhaling cigarette smoke. I don't go fart in your face, don't put your cigarette smoke in mine.Quote:
Originally Posted by s10sakota
Sam Swift
At least you can dodge that. What I could never understand is the people who smoke INSIDE the portolets.
And from everything I saw during the week -- and from comments on another thread about the absence of Protect Our Planes volunteers -- there nothing to keep such people from smoking in the near proximity of the airplanes! I never saw it happening, but there was nothing and no one to inform people that it was both forbidden and genuinely dangerous. Just from the numbers, I am guessing that many more than half of the people attending are not pilots and they should not be expected to know about smoking and airplanes.
I was at another event some time ago, where my airplane which had, again, been over fueled. A couple of men came up with lit cigarettes. They looked the kind who came in on Harley's rather than in Pipers. As they got inside of the 50 foot circle I asked, "Would you smoke around a race car?" The light went on and I politely added, "Same fuel, same spillage problems." They were apologetic and immediately put the cigarettes out. It is not that many smokers are trouble in and of themselves -- they just don't know. Pilots are not always near enough to their airplanes to explain it to them.
Sure, we all know not to smoke around airplanes. However, if airplanes and smoking are apparently an automatic catastrophic conflagration, why did manufacturers build them with cigarette lighters and multiple ashtrays for several decades?
I used to smoke. I didn't smoke around the outside of the planes, especially when fueling. I did, however, smoke while flying. They ashtrays on top of the instrument panel of a Stinson 108 were really handy. :)
I was thinking what might happen if just the right, um, fuel air mixture was achieved in one of those...Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingRon
Regarding wifi, my suggestion to EAA is to look at whatever you did for exhibitors and try to replicate it for the public. As an exhibitor, I only had one problem connecting with either our PC, or my iPad, and that foe just a few minutes. Admittedly, the data rate was a bit slow (had to wait to get to the house to send pictures from our breakfast to our editor after transferring them from my DSLR), but for text and email, it was acceptable.
I just got back from spending the week at Airventure 2013 and what a great time it was. I want to thank all the EAA employees and volunteers for all the hard work. Your dedication makes it possible for the rest of us to attend the worlds’ greatest aviation event.
This year I noted some improvements and firsts for me that I really appreciated. The food selection was greatly improved which was nice for those of us spending several days onsite. As always the number and variety of forums was tremendous. I really enjoy the flying at the ultralight strip, and the seaplane base. The list goes on and on.
However, there were a couple things that could be improved on also. First, the number of golf carts and gators was out of hand as was the speed that they were traveling. I understand the need to move supplies around the grounds and I have no issue with that. But many, if not most were being used to strictly for transportation. There were people roaming the flymart isles in golf carts doing shopping. There were families (mom, dad, and the kids) riding around through the crowds. People drove their carts into the crowd to watch the concerts. This really got under my skin and should be stopped. Additionally, all carts and gators need visible signs indicating who is responsible for them so that misuse can be identified and reported.
Second, this was my first year camping in HBC. I arrived on the first Saturday and was parked back in row 304 with my Titan Tornado. Part way through the week I got a new neighbor in a nice RV-8 who wondered why he was parked in the back with the rest of the odd ball aircraft since in past years they have reserved the front rows for the RV’s. I don’t know if that’s true, but you would be hard pressed to find someone that didn’t think that it was. RV’s are great and I would love to have one. They are the most popular kit aircraft ever and we all get that. But there are so many other designs being built currently and in the past and they are invisible in back of the mass of the Vans Air Force. I would really love to see the first 4 or 5 rows in HBC (closest to the forums) reserved for non-RV aircraft. This would help showcase the true variety of homebuilt options for prospective builders that can’t afford a Vans kit, and give the rest of us some different types of aircraft to look at. I had looked at the HBC area on past trips and assumed that it was an RV type only area, as I know others have. Let’s get some variety on display and show others that there are viable alternatives in the homebuilt arena.
I think that these improvements would make Airventure safer, less frustrating, more interesting for all.
Keep up the great work and I’ll see you in 350 days.
Malcolm Morrison
I always enjoy Airventure, and have attended the last 14 consecutive years, and will continue to do so, but here are some things on my list this year.
Pros:
1. New food vendors were great!
2. Liked the jumbotron idea for stuff like Jetman
3. The Sunday airshow was awesome, better than I remember in years past. Team AeroDynamix (RV's) was great as well.
Now the Cons:
1. The reduced number of cars on the grounds was great, but the golf carts and gators...Yikes, like others said they were everywhere and ran around the grounds like a bunch of idiots...I felt I was always looking behind me so I wouldn't get run down.
2. The showcase mixed in with the airshow, yuck. The others in my group also were not pleased with the set-up of that. Also in the airshow arena, disappointed I didn't get to see Kyle Franklin fly Dracula.
3. WIFI was spotty, especially in the north parts of the grounds.
4. I saw a lot of people leaving garbage laying around and a lot more smoking than in past years.
5. Bag checks at the front gates were pointless.
6. On Sunday, Family day, so much stuff was being packed up by 10am. I understand the vendors want to get home but a lot of locals go that day and I think it is a turn off to getting local people more interested in EAA and aviation.
7. My biggest gripe. The north 40 buses. I hate getting on the bus only to stop to let 1 person off at a specific row, then the bus moves and someone else stops the bus literally 4-5 rows later...seriously annoying and creates a lot of congestion during busy times. I think 5 or 6 dedicated stops would make the north 40 bus run so much smoother. Stops at the gate, the showers, at the end of 9/27, Friar tucks, the Hilton and the Fire Dept. would get people close enough to where they need to get to. Mark the stops and make it so the buses only drop and pick up there, just like the trams on the grounds.
Can't wait until AV14!!!
I was there for 6 days, and agree that it was a grreat show this year, with some very nice improvements.
I think the bike path between the N40 and Camp Sholler has been a great improvement. But like others have mentioned the golf carts were a real hazard. The path is simply not wide enough for bikes , pedestrians, golf carts and motor bikes. This was not much of a problem before this year, not sure what put the carts and motor bikes on the path. This problem was worse at night, as the cart lights were blindingly bright.
This was my first time, and I'm awed at how much work and thought went into putting on such a huge event. Great job!
I didn't find it very friendly for a first-timer, though. At the registration, I bought a program (turned out to be almost nothing but advertising), and among that and the other handouts were nothing that told what vendors were where, what seminars there were and when they were to be held, or a schedule of events. I asked a few people and was directed to the daily newspaper, but that gave only the day's events. Late on the second day I discovered, at one of the food stands as I recall, a program that showed all the information I was looking for. It would have been very helpful to me if I could have gotten that when I registered, and I would have gotten to see a number of things that I missed because of its lack. The map, which I was given at registration, was very helpful if a bit cryptic in places. If I go again some time, I'll print out the schedule of events from the web before I go, and bring it with me.
It was a long walk from the north 40 to the show entrance. The buses were often full so wouldn't take anyone, and the wait for the next one was usually longer than it took to walk. So I walked it most of the time.
In the north 40 I took only one shower because it was scaldingly hot. Not uncomfortably hot, but hot enough to burn. And no way or person to adjust it. I ended up using a T-shirt as a sort of wash cloth to let the water cool and then slosh it on.
In general, it seemed that it was assumed that everyone had been there many times before, and indeed just about everyone I met had. My one constructive suggestion is for the management to put themselves in the shoes of someone there for the first time, and consider how sketchy the available information is.
But for such a huge undertaking, it went remarkably smoothly.
Roy
I don't mean this in a condescending way, but next time, look harder at the contents of your bag--this year what everyone called the Flo Bag. I also had trouble knowing what was when and where all the vendors' booths were located. When I got home and unpacked, I finally looked through the Flo Bag in detail--and guess what? All that information was in one or another of the items in it! Granted, I'm a repeater, so it didn't hamper my experience very much not to know where and when things were in detail, but if I'd just looked, I would have known.
Of course, you could always do what a couple of ladies did as we rode together from the North 40 one morning. One of them asked me if I'd been there before and then said to me, "We aren't interested in airplanes at all--do you know where the crafts are?" I pointed in the general direction of the Fly Mart, where I knew there were craft vendors in past years and told her that's where they were, unless that was changed this year. (Gosh, I hope I was right!) Of course, then I kidded her about coming to Airventure but with no interest in airplanes, and she said that was their husbands' thing, so she and her friend just came along. I then suggested they might consider going to the museum, which even for a non-aviation person was pretty fascinating, and I told her about the Seaplane Base, which is just incredibly relaxing.
As for the showers, I took a shower each day at the new shower house and never found the water to be excessively warm or cool. I have learned, however, to take showers during times that aren't crowded, because I think the water temp then is more even. If you take a shower right after the morning rush, it tends to be hotter, but if you wait an hour, it's not quite as hot but really pretty comfortable.
Next time, use the trams to go from the North 40 entrance to the main areas--lots easier than using the bus, and the waits aren't all that long. They are seldom full going to and from the North 40 unless you try to get on mid-route, except perhaps first thing in the morning. You'll still walk a lot--that's a given--but perhaps not as much. I think the trams can be better marked, but once you know their routes, you can literally travel from one end of the field to the other on them, and stop everywhere in between.
For sure, come back--at this point I have spent the whole week the last 3 years, and I'm still missing things each year.
Cary
I think it depends on where you bought your wristband. My pile of junk from registering in the camping registration did not include the newsprint forum schedule/exhibitors directory. Of course, having been coming to Oshkosh for many years I specifically asked for one after declining the "slick" program.
This year, I received a full printed forum and event schedule with my wrist band registration. I had it on the iPad as well, but the paper was much better since I scribbled notes easily. At home, my itinerary was done on iPad in advance, but the forum itinerary was lost twice... So I gave up on the iPad.
The $5 program is unneeded.
There are some important points above that should make your next visit more enjoyable (and I am always adjusting my my own approach each year.)
1. Plan in advance. The EAA website has the list of forums well in advance of AirVenture. Of course, things change up until the day of, but it is good to be prepared.
2. What is in the bag is nice, but not necessary. The AirVenture App has it all, with tools to show you where to go for what you are looking for.
3. In the morning, pick up the newspaper so you have something to quickly refer to and scribble on. Aside from that, there were some cases where the app did not keep up with the latest changes. The paper SHOULD have that.
4. Sorry about your experience in the showers. I used the ones at Warbirds and the on south side of the north 40. I have nothing but great things to say about the second location.
5. As part of item 1, above, ask questions on this forum! We are all (or mostly all) friendly people who would like everyone to have a great time at AirVenture (even our long-suffering non-pilot better halves!)
Somewhere else, it was suggested that EAA put together a "First Time at AirVenture" guide to help people plan their trip. This is a great idea. It is so great that I would be happy to help, if someone could point me in the right direction.
Had a really great time this year and loved the cooler temps. I'm not sure why, but it really seemed to be more of a club event as opposed to a corporate one this year.
Here is my list of possible 2014 improvements:
1. Shorten the tram volunteer time to 3-4 hours per shift. I always appreciate them and planned on volunteering this year, but 8-2 or 2-8 seems like a lot longer time than any other volunteer job I've done in the past.
2. If you're going to sell all bottled drinks, make sure there are easily accessible recycle bins.
3. Vehicle traffic was a lot better than in previous years, but it can still be improved. I think the EAA volunteers and staff really made an effort this year, but the worst offenders seem to be the exhibitors. I saw a bunch at concerts, airshows, etc. It also seemed like they were the ones ignoring the restricted vehicle area signs and driving through the crowds. (Although the little "tell us how we're driving" stickers were a little small to read as they went by)
4. I have to agree that I noticed more smoking, liter, and full toilets than I've ever seen in the past. The absence of these items is has always been an amazing part of Oshkosh, let's figure out how to eliminate them again.
5. I went to visit the type clubs in the Vintage Barn on Saturday morning and found an empty room. I know people complain that people pack up too early on Sunday, but Saturday morning seemed way too early.
6. Sadly, the fly-in theater movie list is the item that I anticipate the most every year. Last year one night was very easy to skip because of the non-aviation movie that played. This year I only attended two nights. Please bring back the aviation movies (and old ads and WWII cartoons too!).
7. Bring back the orange volunteer shirts. It used to be very easy to pick out the volunteers out of the crowd (even if it was a previous year's shirt). I think that seeing all the orange shirts in the past made people realize how easy it was to volunteer, and want to do it themselves. The red, blue, & yellow ones have just blend into the crowd.
I believe, despite the appearance of some cans marked as recycle, the entire show was single streamed this year.Quote:
Originally Posted by rawheels
The type clubs are staffed by more volunteers from the type clubs (except for the one which actually is a sham enterprise of the aircraft "manufacturer" that the EAA lets in there to sucker people). It may not be that they packed up, but they were doing other things.Quote:
5. I went to visit the type clubs in the Vintage Barn on Saturday morning and found an empty room. I know people complain that people pack up too early on Sunday, but Saturday morning seemed way too early.
THey're been different colors each year since they've started doing these. Actually, I don't ever wear the one given me. I don't feel I need to be a walking billboard for Bendix-King's obsolete and otherwise useless for Sport Aviation avionics.Quote:
7. Bring back the orange volunteer shirts. It used to be very easy to pick out the volunteers out of the crowd (even if it was a previous year's shirt). I think that seeing all the orange shirts in the past made people realize how easy it was to volunteer, and want to do it themselves. The red, blue, & yellow ones have just blend into the crowd.
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingRon
For the record, the food service provider at the Seaplane Base was not operated by Volunteers. Seaplane Base management became aware early on that the vendor was overwhelmed due to being new and consequently had Seaplane Base volunteers help them during a couple of busy periods in an effort to reduce wait time and stress on everyone. Seaplane Base management would like express their apologies to those who had a negative experience in any way. Please contact Paul Seehafer, Seaplane Base Chairman, 715-581-4381 with your concerns.
Ann Seehafer, Vice Chairman, Volunteer and Guest Relations, AirVenture Seaplane Base
Roy,Quote:
Originally Posted by GroupW
Like many others who replied to this thread, when I registered at the N40 registration, I had the visitor's guide in my bag. If it was not in yours (and it sounds like you also checked in at N40 given your comment below), perhaps it was an oversight! FWIW, you can also obtain the same document in .pdf form online in the weeks leading to the show. I don't usually print the whole thing since I'm cheap when it comes to wasting printer paper, but I do usually print a few pages - if this works for you, next year you could also print a few of the relevant pages.
We had our two daughters (ages 7 & 9) with us. If you thought it was hot for you, imagine how hot they thought it was! (Hint - it was not a fun shower time.) I agree it was scalding the first day we used the showers (must have been Monday morning since we arrived Sunday). But I know that a few people complained, and it was a little cooler Tuesday. On Wednesday it was almost too cool - made me wonder if two different people had heard complaints and made independent adjustments to the temperature! But in any case it was much better; I think the staff or volunteers responded quickly to the complaints of the hot water.Quote:
Originally Posted by GroupW
I realize none of this helps you as a first timer, but I think a lot of us are just trying to help with suggestions for future years.
In general, my wife and I both thought OSH was better than average this year. Of course the weather was awesome, but everyone - from tram drivers to food staffers to other attendees - seemed to be in a much better mood than typical. Maybe that was also because the weather was so nice! :) Or maybe it was because this year we attended Sun-Thurs instead of our typical Wed-Sat. It was so much better that I think we may adjust our schedules to attend the first part of the week going forward, just in case that was the cause of it!
They weren't just away from the tables, the entire room had been torn down and all that remained were the stacks of folded tables in the corner and signs for each group hanging from the ceiling. I'm not sure if they use the building for an event Saturday evening or something, but it seemed odd to have it empty on one of the busiest days of the event.Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingRon
I've only been attending for 10 years, so I'm not sure how long the shirts have been around, but I know that I had orange ones from 2005-2008 and it seems there were older ones than those at the event. I'm pretty sure that 2009 was the first change in color (yellow) and I remember looking around when we got there and thinking what happened to all of the volunteers? If they don't want to go back to orange, could we at least get some day-glo or something that stands out in the crowd?Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingRon
The orange Volunteer shirts where not used again after they cause "issues" in the aircraft parking area's. All Volunteer crews working in Flight Line Operations be it Vintage, Home Built, Warbirds, N40 etc wear Orange vests. The mass of Orange Volunteer T's was confusing to pilots taxing. I do not believe there were any accidents, just a few near misses. They only used Orange once that I am aware of .That was in 2008 They used Yellow for 09 Blue 2010 and 12 Green?? 2011 Red 2013..
Why do they even try to have forums while the Aero Shell team is performing ????
it is impossable to hear the speaker !!!!
they should have them perform first--and not schedule any forums at that time.
its a insult to the people trying to get their knowledge accross to the people attending the forum
Kevin
Different kind of Gripe.
I tried to find a tripod adapter. 1/4" to 3/8" to mount a fluid head on a monopod for my daughter to use. My guess is that, during Airventure, more pictures are taken by more cameras than at any other time and place in the State of Wisconsin during the rest of the year. So, I thought, there must be a camera vendor here somewhere. I couldn't find one. I eventually drove to downtown Oshkosh, to Camera Casino, and just as they were closing for the day bought one, a $1.15 purchase.
I struck up a conversation with the salesperson, asked him why they didn't get a booth at the show for the week, there must be lots of business. He said they used to, EAA had been increasing booth fees every year, and demanded 35% of the gross sales. They would have had to increase their prices 50% just to break even. Booth fee of $7000?
I've never been involved in running this kind of huge convention, but it strikes me that there should be some differentiation between the out of state vendors who hop from convention to convention and sell at inflated prices because they are the only vendor at the show, and a local business in Oshkosh.
Whatever the "normal policies" are for trade shows/conventions, I don't care. I'm an EAA member, and this guy was unhappy with EAA. We need to keep Oshkosh residents and businesses happy to see us. I think it's absolutely ridiculous that I couldn't find a $1 tripod adapter at the highest concentration of cameras in the Midwest. When I heard the reason they stopped renting their booth, I was angry. EAA needs to stop being all about sucking every possible dollar out of exhibitors, visitors, and members. I understand that it takes money to keep all the programs rolling, but didn't this year's financial report show that we had an ADDITIONAL $2 MILLION in the bank? AFTER all the improvements to the grounds?
I'm not advocating we return to non-air conditioned sheds and dirt roads, but there's got to be a better equilibrium point than screwing the local Oshkosh businesses. Set some requirement, like business address in City of Oshkosh that's in operation year round, or something like that. Then, if an out of state carpetbagger wants to game the system to have EAA take a little less of their margin at least they have to pay rent (and someone pays state/local taxes) to someone in Oshkosh.
Please tell me this guy was exaggerating. 35% of gross and $7000 booth fee? Really? Now I think I understand why the exhibit halls were set up with walkways (the floor space that DIDN'T have booths...) in a grid and not long rows like every other trade show I've been to. We didn't have enough booths filled to do it. While I liked the ease of navigating, it struck me that exhibitors must have been down by at least 10% from previous years to allow that much open floor space. Is the economy that bad, or are we charging too much for booths?
Airventure is *NOT* an entity to itself. The EAA relies on the profit from Airventure to fund both the EAA proper and the EAA Foundation (the museum and educational programs) for the rest of the year.
Having a mil in reserve (about one years budget from the show) covers if they get another disaster like Sloshkosh or the farking feds sucking a half-mil unexpectedly.
I am pretty sure Jack said they had the highest number of vendors ever this year, but I may have heard that incorrectly.Quote:
Originally Posted by cptomes
I do agree that local vendors be given some sort of discount to be on the grounds if they have a relevent product that members may be looking for.
Hello Everyone,
I just wanted to touch base on the references to exhibits in the thread above. In the exhibitor sales department, we try our best to make exhibiting at AirVenture a rewarding experience for all exhibitors with various budgets and ROI levels. We offer many different options for all budgets ranging from the Fly Market to indoor space inside of our exhibit hangars. In 2013, we saw a record number of exhibitors with 821 that ranged from the Main Aircraft Display to Ultralight to our new College Park venue.
The floorplans for the exhibit venues were designed several years ago and have not changed in a few years. Hangars A, B and D have more of a straight aisle layout, where Hangar C (which was expanded a few years ago) has a layout that features more islands and exhibit spaces with three sides of frontage. These layouts were designed based on feedback from our business partners so that they receive more visability for their investment.
From a revenue perspective, we try to make participating in our event economical for everyone. That is why we offer a wide variety of venues based on the budget of the exhibitor. We charge a flat rate for their space based on square footage and we do NOT collect a percentage of sales. The revenue from all of our AirVenture Exhibits do fund many of the year-long programs that we offer through EAA. We try our best to reach out to local companies and organizations and will continue to do this in the future. We will also continue to create new ideas for exhibit venues like College Park, which is a great new addition to AirVenture and highlighted EAA's commitment to education and the future of aviation.
Best Regards,
Holly Williams
EAA Business Relationship Manager, Exhibits
That's correct - it was a record number this year:Quote:
Originally Posted by krw920
http://www.airventure.org/news/2013/...ture-2013.html
Thank You, Holly, for providing factual data.
That said, I was not the original poster, I can see where it could be worthwhile to have some type of camera vendor on-site.
FWIW, the battery vendor (can't recall which building they were in) also had a lot of camera-specific thingies, in addition to an enormous number of off-the-wall batteries. While I was waiting, about 3rd in line, one of the customers ahead of me asked about a camera-mount, and they had it. When it was my turn, I was looking for a rechargeable battery pack for my 9 year old Vertex-Standard hand-held--and after rifling through a box, the rep found one!
I think that's the kind of vendor that belongs at Airventure--not the sellers of Egyptian sheets, pots & pans, folding ladders, and such. If I want to go to a generic flea market, then that's my call, but when I go to Airventure, I admit to some disappointment and annoyance when I'm bugged by hawkers of non-aviation stuff.
Cary
Actually last year I was asking about a battery holder for a Vertex Standard at their booth and they just handed me one.
Love the show as always, no major gripes but some deficiencies, in my opinion. 1. We always camp on the flight line, about row 92 to get away from the loud speakers so the blue line is our home route. This year I rode it less then once a day as there were only 2 trams and they traveled in tandem. Yes there were buses but not nearly often enough. The bus drivers were very nice, polite! It was far quicker to walk to the hanger café where the rest of the tram service was very good all week! 2. No place to get a sit down evening meal. Think steak here. As we fly in and have no wish to try and find our way off the grounds in the evening we missed that meal at least twice a week. Other wise the food was good but ice cream was hard to come by because of the lines and it was not hot! 3. I saw more then one person smoking while wandering down the flight line. I can't remember that ever happing before. 4. No chair police so what I saw were a lot of chairs just waiting for an arriving aircraft to launch them in to flight. I have been hearing a lot of grumbling from some of your long time venders on your pricing the last few years, just saying. I know of several smaller venders as a matter of fact who just pass on this show as it is way expensive. L
Steve,Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve "Limey Owen
2007 & 2008 were orange, one of them is a dead ringer for our chairman shirts :-) . 2009 is yellow, 2010 is blue, 2012 is blue, 2013 is red. 2011 is the cloak of invisibility!
Jim
Cary, I will politely disagree because some of these things are needed for aviation. Folding ladder? Yep, I have a high wing airplane with no steps and my friend has a biplane that he religiously cleans the leading edges on. Cleaning materials? Always looking for something to make cleaning easier. I wasn't bugged by a single "hawker" the entire week at OSH including walking through the Fly Market where I expect the "junk" sellers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cary
If you ever want to see how bad hawkers can be try walking down Nathan Road in Kowloon, Hong Kong. Or walk into the Fenxiang (sp?) Costume Market on Nanjing Road in Shanghai, it is even worse! I layover in both cities for work, which is flying.
Not to start an argument, but I'll bet neither of you needs a 24 in 1 ladder that can be an A-frame ladder, extension ladder, staircase ladder, 90 degree ladder, which can be part of a scaffolding system, which weighs from 24 lbs. to 39 lbs., all for only $199.95 to $259.95, depending on your choice of sizes, just to check your fuel level or clean off the bugs from the leading edges. My highwing airplane has no steps, either, but my old 2-step Aero ladder (the one with wooden steps) works well.Quote:
Yep, I have a high wing airplane with no steps and my friend has a biplane that he religiously cleans the leading edges on.
I don't deny that some of the non-aviation stuff might be useful for aviation, just that there's so much stuff that would be more at home at an ordinary flea market--or perhaps in Shanghai or Hong Kong. If I want to go there, I'd expect it; if I go to Airventure, I expect distinctly aviation-oriented merchandise, fuddy-duddy that I am. :)
Cary
Here is a little input from a 1st timer. I stayed in Camp Scholler near 13th and Lindbergh in my old Airstream. I had a great time and really have nothing I'd call a complaint, but maybe a few suggestions;)
First, I was incredibly impressed by the logistics. I have gone to concerts and festivals with only a fraction of a % of the attendees of Airventure that couldn't come close to AV's level of proficiency when it came to providing the basic needs. I gather from reading some of the posts here that this hasn't always been the case. I was particularly impressed that I never had to stand in line to take a shower or use a restroom or portable toilet. Never had to stand in line for more then a few minutes for food or water.
Suggestions:
1) I'll add to the request for better WiFi coverage.
2) It would be nice if the venders stayed open for a while after the afternoon airshow.
3) I was surprised that there was no interactive geo-referenced map app available. The Sporty's app was great but the map was static. I made my own using the Custom Maps app for Android but since the event map was not geo-referenced, position was only "in the vicinity". An interactive map that showed you where you where with the ability to select a destination such as a forum location and have it also appear on the map would be very useful, especially for 1st timers.
4) The trams were great but as previously mentioned there was a lot of confusion about which direction the trams were heading at certain stops.
Maybe there could be some effort to encourage all non-aviation related vendors to rent space in a single exhibit hangar? On the other hand, some of those vendors (like the ladder people) have been attending for a lot longer than me, and it is tradition that they are in the same place every year. I actually bought a CD from Jerry's One Man Band this year because each year seems like it is his last one coming, and it will feel weird when he is no longer on his corner.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cary
Ultimately, those sellers won't return unless they are making money. So, somebody likes them and evidently there aren't more aviation related companies beating down the door to rent those spaces for the same price or the exhibit hangers wouldn't have empty spots.
The exhibitors don't bother me. Unless we get back to the way it was prior to the construction of the new buildings where these NON-avation things DISPLACED real aviation vendors from the prime exhibit space (used to be quite a arcane way of allocating space that really disadvantaged some of the new guys). The fact that a lot of the big exhibitors (Garmin, Bose, etc...) have moved into their own Chalets in the square has opened up even more.
This is definitely an anti-Gripe:Quote:
Originally Posted by rawheels
I was walking by and Jerry was on a break. I stopped and talked to him for a few minutes (I had bought a CD the day before). He told me he was overwhelmed by the number of folks coming up and telling him how much they enjoyed him being there! I added my thanks and a personal story about how his music almost brings tears to my eyes at times.
He is in his early 80s (83?) and is slowing down. He told me that last winter was the first one in years that he didn't travel down south (AZ/NM area) during the winter as the drive towing his trailer was getting too nerve-wracking. Of course with over half a million miles on the 1976 Dodge Van, I can only imagine the stories he could tell just about his drives.
He is a wonderful gentleman, not unlike Mr. Poberezny. I wished him well and didn't say good-bye but "until next time."
Surprised no one has mentioned charging $18/day for passes for EAA Member's kids 6 and up. My Dad started taking me in the early 80s and I have only missed one AirVenture since then. There were years my brother and I each brought 2 friends and my Dad paid for everyone's addmission, but I doubt he would have at 18 bucks a pop. Take a look at other major airshows and nobody charges that much for kids.
Reno comes close $17/day for the Races on Saturday and Sunday, but only $5 for the days earlier in the week.
Wings over Houston $4,
CAF AirSho $5
Planes Of Fame Airshow $5
Dayton Airshow $15 at the gate $12 in advance.
For an Organization that prides itself on getting kids into aviation to charge that to get kids into AirVenture seems a bit outragous...
It will not keep me from bringing my kids and their friends, but it may limit how many days we all go to the show and how much we spend on food and other items on the field.
Bryan Darnell
EAA # 80374