Future events affected

[saber25]

With SNF 1st week of April, AV last week in July, and the Olympics last week in July and first week in August, these large venues may well be affected by the current virus infection. It'll be interesting to see how the organizations handle these large upcoming events. I'll confine my flights to the Intermountain West and visit the many out of the way, picturesque airfields out here. ;)

[Floatsflyer]

Large and small public gatherings all over the world are already being cancelled. OSH is months away so there is hopefully time to get this virus reduced and under more control. In any event a decision probably doesn't need to be made until the end of May subject to conditions at that time.

The Olympics in Tokyo is a very different situation that could be the most negatively impacted because of location, over 200 countries participating and the largest public gathering of humans in one place on the planet.

I heard that Saudi Arabia is considering cancelling Mecca.

[Airmutt]

I suspect EAA management is quietly monitoring the situation. Travel bans if still in effect will impact foreign attendance. The wild card will be if the outbreak is viewed in the US as “under control” or not. If attendance craters EAA could take a big financial hit. Impacts to the supply chain are already showing up - will we see it at AV? It’s anybody’s guess. Attendance to major functions in the late spring and early summer will be good markers. Let’s all hope this outbreak gets quickly controlled.

[rwanttaja]

I think the media hype will affect events in the near term (like Sun-N-Fun), but I think people will be numb to it by AirVenture time.

Ron Wanttaja

[Bill Greenwood]

Viruses seem to thrive in cold weather. Think about all the people jammed together in forum tents on the trams in line for food or porta potty, and I have been coming to EAAfor 40 years and never recall any widespread cold outbreak or any food poisoning episode. That is amazing condsidering how much food and drink is sold and is most cases from rather basic food tents and not full kitchens with all the cleaning facilities. And lots of people camping with group showers. And this also includes every fast food place and restaurant and hotel for probably 30 miles around. One thing handy is so much food is moved that you have fresh coming in everyday and not much sitting in storage getting spoiled. But with people coming from all over the world, I think we have been lucky as well as maybe good also.

[CHICAGORANDY]

There is a lot of misinformation and media hysteria too. The 'plain old flu' kills tens of thousands in the USA every year. Reports I've been reading on this latest strain would seem to indicate that most all who contract it have no life-threatening consequences. As always the greatest risk falls among those whose immune systems are already weakened.

[Floatsflyer]

I think the media hype will affect events in the near term (like Sun-N-Fun), but I think people will be numb to it by AirVenture time.

Ron Wanttaja

If the virus becomes more widespread and containment is not occurring as quickly as health officials and experts would like, then the exact opposite will occur.

To be "numb to it" is to be in denial and unprepared. I also wouldn't call anything related to a worldwide disease outbreak "media hype".

[Floatsflyer]

Viruses seem to thrive in cold weather.

I'm pretty confident that all those thousands who died from Ebola in sub-Sahara Africa would vehemently disagree with you.

[rwanttaja]

If the virus becomes more widespread and containment is not occurring as quickly as health officials and experts would like, then the exact opposite will occur.

To be "numb to it" is to be in denial and unprepared. I also wouldn't call anything related to a worldwide disease outbreak "media hype".

You're right; I should have used a term like media "Over-Hype." I'm just peeved at our local TV station using the term "Abundance of caution" six times in last night's half-hour newscast. As Randy pointed out, the average well person isn't that much at risk of dying. Having a 94-year-old father in assisted living, I'm worrying a bit about him.

Spanish Flu killed millions a century ago. The difference there was that it tended to kill the young and healthy. With much of the male youth of the world in the military for WWI, it ran rampant.

I've been retired for three years now, and have been amazed at how few colds or other communicable diseases I suffered over that time. Makes a difference not going daily to a work environment. Haven't had the flu, and am just getting over the only cold I've had over that time (mild). Got THAT from my wife...but in retrospect, her symptoms sounded a lot like Covid-19.

Covid-19's major threat is that it *doesn't* have a high fatality rate. It spreads more by not killing most of the hosts quickly.

Might be, as outdoor venues, air shows would be less prone to support the disease's spread. But I doubt that'll be a factor in people's decisions. In any case, a large percentage of attendees will be traveling in long incubation tubes made by Boeing, Airbus, Embraer, etc.

Ron Wanttaja

[Bill Greenwood]

Floats I am not an expert on Ebola nor too concerned with it affecting EAA and I wont be visiting Africa, but just to be sure looked it up on internet. And , as often, it seems you are incorrect, Just on Ebola it says. "Cold increases Ebola survival." and other items mention how flu and norovirus thrive in cold weather, probably why it is called the common COLD, and why we have less flue cases in summer and are urged to get vaccinated in fall.
It is great to know that you are monitoring every word I write, can of like the narcs looking though my trash.

[Floatsflyer]

You're right; I should have used a term like media "Over-Hype." I'm just peeved at our local TV station using the term "Abundance of caution" six times in last night's half-hour newscast. As Randy pointed out, the average well person isn't that much at risk of dying. Having a 94-year-old father in assisted living, I'm worrying a bit about him.

Might be, as outdoor venues, air shows would be less prone to support the disease's spread. But I doubt that'll be a factor in people's decisions.

Ron Wanttaja

The only confirmed deaths in the US so far from this virus happen to be where you live so I understand your local TV station telling its viewers to exercise an "abundance of caution".

And yes, you should be concerned about your dad in assisted living. I know first hand that senior citizen facilities, even under the best of conditions and cautionary steps taken when not dealing with things like Coronavirus, are major incubators of virus and sickness spreads.

I don't think it matters if an event is indoors or outdoors. The virus is more prone to be spread within large gatherings of human beings whether inside or out and likely affects older/seniors. Doesn't mean you'll die of course, especially if you are otherwise healthy, but you could be quite ill. And with OSH, we know the attendees skew older demo.

[rwanttaja]

The only confirmed deaths in the US so far from this virus happen to be where you live so I understand your local TV station telling its viewers to exercise an "abundance of caution".
I don't mind them using the phase once, or even twice, but six times in 30 minutes is a bit much. Then again, this particular station isn't strong in English. They misspell a LOT of words in their captions... "caughing", for instance.

I thought this article was interesting...it's a first-person account of coming down with COVID-19:

https://slate.com/technology/2020/03/i-had-the-coronavirus-worst-part-stigma.html

This was in Italy. I'd hope that the stigma issues she reports won't occur in the US, but I'm not too optimistic.

Ron Wanttaja

[Floatsflyer]

Ron, I understand that there are now 6 deaths from the virus in the Seattle area, 3 of them in a nursing home. I hope your dad isn't in that one. Take good care, be well.

My niece and her husband and twin daughters live in Seattle, both work for Microsoft. They're fine. But I'm concerned even though here in Ontario we have 18 confirmed with the virus but no deaths. We have very strong provincial public health units here with plans and preparedness. At the federal government level we have a Prime Minister, a leader who doesn't need constant attention, praise and ego stroking so he allows the experts, the doctors, the epidemiologists, the entire medical and disease control system to do all the talking to inform, educate and PROTECT the public with honest, truthful and factual information.

And that BS Vaccine that certain indivduals talk about is not just around the corner, it's at least a year away according to all the experts(you know, the scientists and researchers who create these things) and 18 months away from full distribution capability. DO NOT BELIEVE ANYTHING OR ANYONE ELSE. Take every simple precaution to protect yourself.

[rwanttaja]

Ron, I understand that there are now 6 deaths from the virus in the Seattle area, 3 of them in a nursing home. I hope your dad isn't in that one. Take good care, be well.
Thanks, Floats. My wife and I are the only Wanttajas on the West Coast...my dad is about 2,000 miles away. It'll get there eventually, of course.

They're now saying it reached Seattle about six weeks ago, which actually corresponds when my wife started feeling some pretty bad crud, which, as I said in an earlier post, matched the symptoms of COVID-19. She's recovered, now. She's contacted the local local health department to see if they want to test her.

Frankly, I don't think they're going to be able stop this. It'll just have to run its course.

Ron Wanttaja

[steve]

The thinking in the medical community suggests any newly developed vaccine won't be ready for clinical trials until much later this year. Distribution would be sometime after successful testing and manufacturing.

[Floatsflyer]

They're now saying it reached Seattle about six weeks ago, which actually corresponds when my wife started feeling some pretty bad crud, which, as I said in an earlier post, matched the symptoms of COVID-19. She's recovered, now. She's contacted the local local health department to see if they want to test her.

Frankly, I don't think they're going to be able stop this. It'll just have to run its course.

Ron Wanttaja

Pleased to hear your wife has recovered. Getting tested is a great step.

It will eventually stop. All plagues throughout history have ended. Our advanced, superior medical science and knowledge throughout the world coupled with modern hygiene and sanitary standards is the difference. Millions will not die as in the Middle Ages.

[Bill Berson]

I think cold dry air in winter or airline cabins can compromise the body mucus defense and allows virus entry.
https://www.preventdisease.com/news/articles/how_to_avoid_in-flight_colds.shtml

[Airmutt]

Aah, but Ron we are much more mobile. Your ability to unwittingly infect others is much greater now vs the Middle Ages. The first case in Georgia, actually Atlanta, just got reported; had traveled to Milan. The rate of infection is actually starting to accelerate both here in the US and globally. Technology doesn’t really help when the vast majority of our pharmaceuticals are produced in China. 95% of all ibuprofen is manufactured in China. Granted the death rate is relatively low. If this goes pandemic even 3-5% of tens of millions is a big number.

The ripple effect is beginning. 70% of the shoes we buy, 40% of the textiles we buy, 100% of baseball cap manufactured all come out of China. If plants are at a stand still now those shortage will appear downstream. Just saw an article stating the airlines could lose up to $30B due all of this. If people restrict travel this Spring and Summer the tourism industry will suffer. AV pumps up to $70M into the local economy and an estimated up to $200M into the state. We’re still planning to summer in Wisconsin but current events may dictate where and how we spend our time. Hopefully it include a fun week at AV. :)

[Auburntsts]

Personally I think it has been overblown:

- More than half of those who have been infected have recovered
- Generally the at risk population for COVID-19 is the same that is at risk from Influenza (primarily the young, old, or immuno-compromised)
- The symptoms from COVID-19 generally fall between a bad cold (which can also be caused by other Coronavirus strains (yes Corona virus isn't new) along with 200 other viruses like Rhinovirus) and a solid case of Infuenza (aka the "Flu").
- To add some perspective, per the CDC over 280.000 have been hospitalized and 16000+ people have died worldwide from Infuenza this flu season

To me the only interesting thing about COVID-19 is the relatively long incubation period which is one of the reasons the virus continues to spread despite efforts to contain it. My advice, eat healthy, wash your hands, and refrain from kissing strangers. Also since ethyl alcohol kills COVID-19, I'll do my part to stem the spread at Osh and here at home by consuming my favorite adult beverages!

[rwanttaja]

My advice, eat healthy, wash your hands, and refrain from kissing strangers.
Man...you REALLY know how to shut down a party. :-)

Doing a Google search for "COVID-19 fatality rate vs. flu" gets a wide range of results ("It's worse!" "It's about the same!" "We can't tell yet!"). Makes you long for the calm, rational world of a presidential debate.

Ron Wanttaja

[Auburntsts]

The HQ CENTCOM Surgeon's Office uses CDC data during their daily COVID-19 update brief (to which I'm privvy) to the CENTCOM Commander. So if the CDC is good enough for them as an authoritative data source to brief the 4-Star, it's good enough for me. YMMV.....

[saber25]

Per AvWeb and other aviation sources.

"Sun ‘n Fun has been postponed until May 5 to 10, 2020 on concerns over the spread of Covid-19. According to Tampa’s foxnews13, the city of Lakeland made the announcement on Friday morning"

[Bill Greenwood]

"Refrain from kissing strangers"????? What better way to get to know someone? Except maybe if they let you fly their airplane. I literally felt some other world type force like a magnet or sideways gravity pullling me in every time I walked by that Spitfire Mk V. And i dont have a twin raitng, do have a little B-17 time, but I sure would like to borrow that Mosquito for a half hour. Hey, if I bend it I'll pay you back, $100 day for the next century!

[rwanttaja]

The other factor to consider is the psychological one. If the COVID-19 plague is real bad, people will be skittish about emerging from self-isolation, even when told it is safe to do so. So, medically, the end of July might be safe, but there may still be a bunch of people who aren't ready to risk it, yet.

It's like kids at the end of the school year, vs. penguins lined up on an ice floe wondering if a predator is in the water. The kids will explode out of the classroom door, ready to go, while the penguins will crowd at the edge of the floe until one loses its balance and drops in the water. And proves, one way or another, whether it's safe.*

From the comments I've seen on various forums, pilots tend to fall in the first category.

However, events like AirVenture (and, increasingly, SNF) have become more reliant on the non-pilot populace, too. Might end up with fewer "casual" visitors, vs. the pilots that make this a destination most years.

Which means, for us, it should tend to be a pretty good show...shorter lines, less crowding, less risk of damage to aircraft.

Doesn't do EAA's bottom line any good, though.....

Ron Wanttaja

*This must be true, I read it in "Mr. Popper's Penguins" when I was about eight years old.

[malexander]

The other factor to consider is the psychological one. If the COVID-19 plague is real bad, people will be skittish about emerging from self-isolation, even when told it is safe to do so. So, medically, the end of July might be safe, but there may still be a bunch of people who aren't ready to risk it, yet.

It's like kids at the end of the school year, vs. penguins lined up on an ice floe wondering if a predator is in the water. The kids will explode out of the classroom door, ready to go, while the penguins will crowd at the edge of the floe until one loses its balance and drops in the water. And proves, one way or another, whether it's safe.*

From the comments I've seen on various forums, pilots tend to fall in the first category.

However, events like AirVenture (and, increasingly, SNF) have become more reliant on the non-pilot populace, too. Might end up with fewer "casual" visitors, vs. the pilots that make this a destination most years.

Which means, for us, it should tend to be a pretty good show...shorter lines, less crowding, less risk of damage to aircraft.

Doesn't do EAA's bottom line any good, though.....

Ron Wanttaja

*This must be true, I read it in "Mr. Popper's Penguins" when I was about eight years old.


This is the camp I'm in. I'm 61 years old. I AM going to OSH, unless I hear at the last minute it's cancelled. Then I'll probably go anyway to see my campground owners/friends, Jeff and Pam and the gang.:)

[Floatsflyer]

This is the camp I'm in. I'm 61 years old. I AM going to OSH, unless I hear at the last minute it's cancelled. Then I'll probably go anyway...

If/when they cancel it won't be at the last minute, EAA won't be that draconian, will they?

[robert l]

I plan to go to A/V this year wheather I get to fly in or drive. I haven't purchased tickets or campground space yet but there's plenty of time. I'm 73, I had the flu in Dec. and then in Jan. I had a bad cough that lasted about 3 weeks and Dec. of 2018 I had pneumonia but I'm still kickin'. I don't have specific plans laid out yet except to be in Oshkosh at least by opening day and preferably a day or two before.
Bob That's all I've got to say about that. Where's my inhaler !

[Airmutt]

I’m in the same boat.
We are planning on heading up to WI sometime in June. Wanted to also take advantage of some of the other in-state events like the Iola car show and the state fair in August. We were planning on playing host to the former LM chief test pilot who looped the C130J at the Farnborough airshow. I got to fly the profile in the sim but being an FTE I was not allowed to be onboard for the real thing, dang.
The virus appears to be slowly spreading north possibly from Chicago. My grand kids called and told me that school has been cancelled for the next couple of weeks. One of my buddies told me the stores have been stripped bare, like everywhere else. Sure hope that’s a short lived effect or it’s gonna make it tough on the campers, particularly the North 40 folks.
I think most EAAers would appreciate smaller crowds. Good for us, bad for EAA.

[Floatsflyer]

I plan to go to A/V this year wheather I get to fly in or drive. I haven't purchased tickets or campground space yet but there's plenty of time. I'm 73, I had the flu in Dec. and then in Jan. I had a bad cough that lasted about 3 weeks and Dec. of 2018 I had pneumonia but I'm still kickin'. I don't have specific plans laid out yet except to be in Oshkosh at least by opening day and preferably a day or two before.
Bob That's all I've got to say about that. Where's my inhaler !

Beautiful, tremendous, perfect.

[Martyfeehan]

Things should be ok by end of July but it will likely be the lawyers that make the decision for EAA on canceling the event. Trump said yesterday this could be an issue till July or possibly August; that can't help with planning. Sun N Fun has been rescheduled for May 5th but that falls inside the 8 week 50 or less people window. They are going to make a final decision on April 17th. I don't see SnF happening at all. I teach fabric covering at Sun and Fun and Airventure for Stewart Systems but I'm not making any plans for a while. We are a small company and can adapt quickly; I wonder about bigger companies? It won't be a big crowd at Airventure if it happens, that's for sure.
Marty

[TinmanJones]

I'm checking (googling different sites) daily on any news for AV. I booked non-refundable rooms and airline tix for the event. My fingers are crossed, but my hopes have dwindled.

[Airmutt]

My wife was supposed to fly into Appleton this past Monday. She had a non refundable ticket and Delta gave her a full refund. It took 2+ hours on hold but the refund process took less than 3 minutes. We have an acquaintance who has a hotel in the area and they’re sweating bullets too. The 3 week AV period represents 20% of their annual business. They are already starting to hurt due to low occupancy, cancelled events, closed restaurant. The local watering holes and eateries are suffering too.
Too many unknowns and variables in play to know if AV going to be on schedule or even at all. For most, it takes a degree of commitment to get there. It’s tough dealing with the unknown.

[TinmanJones]

My wife was supposed to fly into Appleton this past Monday. She had a non refundable ticket and Delta gave her a full refund. It took 2+ hours on hold but the refund process took less than 3 minutes. We have an acquaintance who has a hotel in the area and they’re sweating bullets too. The 3 week AV period represents 20% of their annual business. They are already starting to hurt due to low occupancy, cancelled events, closed restaurant. The local watering holes and eateries are suffering too.
Too many unknowns and variables in play to know if AV going to be on schedule or even at all. For most, it takes a degree of commitment to get there. It’s tough dealing with the unknown.

I called and chatted with the manager where we have our room booked. If COVID-19 is an issue, we will get a full refund back from them. I explained that I hoped is wasn't an issue by then and all was right in the world.
I sure don't want to cancel this trip.

[Floatsflyer]

CAVEAT EMPTOR:

It was a very quiet Wednesday morning in September, 2053 when Jeremy the pilot got up from his bed with a need to go to the bathroom. To Jeremy this wasn't just any ordinary day! This was the day he would open the last package of toilet paper his grandparents bought in the year 2020.

[TXFlyGuy]

From the willingness of most Americans to relinquish their personal freedoms, and the fact the the Wuhan Virus is spreading more rapidly, and flight restrictions are set to run through August, look for AirVenture to be postponed, or cancelled outright.

If the EAA continues with it as planned, they are going to take a major financial hit as attendance will be down...way down.

[Martyfeehan]

and flight restrictions are set to run through August, look for AirVenture to be postponed, or cancelled outright.

If the EAA continues with it as planned, they are going to take a major financial hit as attendance will be down...way down.

I tend to agree, July looks bad either way. What are the flight restrictions you mentioned?
Thanks
Marty

[GeorgeP]

I'm checking (googling different sites) daily on any news for AV. I booked non-refundable rooms and airline tix for the event. My fingers are crossed, but my hopes have dwindled.I suspect you'll find that airlines and accommodation providers will give refunds or vouchers for future use. It is unlikely that, under this global emergency, any supplier of goods and services will deny refunds/vouchers. Good luck.

[Martyfeehan]

I suspect you'll find that airlines and accommodation providers will give refunds or vouchers for future use. It is unlikely that, under this global emergency, any supplier of goods and services will deny refunds/vouchers. Good luck.
I had to cancel my ticket with AA for flight to Florida for SNF. They gave me a voucher but must rebook by end of December and fly within one year of original ticket. Since the next SNF is later, outside the 1 year I must fly with voucher, the voucher is pretty much worthless to me. That $500 is likely to go up in smoke. They have a process for requesting a refund but I don't expect to hear back on that request any time soon, or ever for that matter. The airlines are likely to get a bailout from gov and from tickets like mine that will go unused and unrefunded. Not happy with AA at all and very leary to rebook with them any time soon.
Marty

[Bill Greenwood]

I hope that EAA will keep Airventure going as planned as long as they can. We have 4months till then and things medically and publically may well improve. It is the biggest event of the year for me, and certianly the biggest aviation event. And it is the main reason I am a long time EAA member. Give it a chance to happen. And no one who has doubts is forced to attend if they hold it.

[malexander]

I agree with Bill.
BUT, if you're sick...….satay home.

[steve]

I imagine everyone got the sale notice from HQ for the t-shirts: Oshkosh 2020 shirts for $12.99 with free shipping. Another month and they may be $5 or less.

[GeorgeP]

I had to cancel my ticket with AA for flight to Florida for SNF. They gave me a voucher but must rebook by end of December and fly within one year of original ticket. Since the next SNF is later, outside the 1 year I must fly with voucher, the voucher is pretty much worthless to me. That $500 is likely to go up in smoke. They have a process for requesting a refund but I don't expect to hear back on that request any time soon, or ever for that matter. The airlines are likely to get a bailout from gov and from tickets like mine that will go unused and unrefunded. Not happy with AA at all and very leary to rebook with them any time soon.
Marty


Marty, I'd try for a refund if the voucher conditions are un-acceptable to you.

When our AA flight (Envoy Air) from ORD to ATW was cancelled due to storms on the Saturday before Airventure 2019, I received a full refund of the ORD to ATW fare PLUS a refund of the checked baggage charge. The cancelled flight was the second leg of a two-leg flight from NYC's La Guardia to ATW. It's worth trying, paticularly when it's $500.

What you in the USA, and we here in Australia, need is the consumer protection offered in Europe. It's the world's gold standard IMO.

Good luck with your quest for a refund.

[GeorgeP]

I hope that EAA will keep Airventure going as planned as long as they can. We have 4months till then and things medically and publically may well improve. It is the biggest event of the year for me, and certianly the biggest aviation event. And it is the main reason I am a long time EAA member. Give it a chance to happen. And no one who has doubts is forced to attend if they hold it.


Once again, I doubt that much thought preceded this statement.

[Bill Greenwood]

In my home town we have only one local who has been tested positive for the virus. We do have 18 visitors of a group from Australia of which all who were tested, 15 were positive.

[Airmutt]

I’m agreeing with Bill on this one. It’s just not summer without the 4th of July or AV. I always look forward to both.

Right now there are just too many moving pieces to the puzzle to say yea or nay. There is so much planning involved EAA has to assume the show is a go. It’s far easier to delay or cancel. Am I planning on attending - yup. Am I buying advances tickets - nope.

So if Evers cancels his gathering/shutdown mandate is AV a go, or is EAA looking at other metrics? Would be curious to know what would drive the decision.

[GeorgeP]

In my home town we have only one local who has been tested positive for the virus. We do have 18 visitors of a group from Australia of which all who were tested, 15 were positive.


Hey Bill, thanks for your response.
I cannot understand the reasoning behind your response. Are you saying that Australians are infecting your home town or that you believe that only one person in your home town is infected, or both? I sincerely hope that only one resident is indeed infected but I fear that you may soon learn otherwise. Twenty six thousand of your fellow Americans have tested positive which probably means that an order of magnitude higher may be already infected.

I wish you all the best for the forthcoming battle with this virus and hope that it does not directly affect you or your friends and family. I do not expect to visit this year (although airfares have been purchased and dorm accommodation booked) but I look forward to coming over next year for Airventure 2021.

[Bill Greenwood]

Dave, I am probably more hopeful than actually betting on EAA going forth. I wonder if they don't stick to July, if a slighter later date, say late Sept might work. obviously with kids back in school then it will be smaller, but might still be good weather. and hotels have openings then. Both of my Sons call me several time to tell me not to go out. Maybe I am not fearful enough, but as I wrote we don't have even one person here in the hospital with it. Now they wont test you unless your have symptoms and maybe there are people who just don't know they are positive yet. We are a small town and generally a younger, somewhat healthier population. Our hospital says our life expectancy is 10 years more than average, the big factor being almost no one smokes tobacco here. I used to be more active, ran 3 10k races and skied a lot. and Im probably within 5 lbs of good weight. We don't have the air pollution from autos like some big cities, and for as I know don't have the real hard core drug use, though lots of pot. I don't use, at least not yet, but then we've only been all shut down a week. I m sure washing my hands 10 times a day.

PS, what is clean,what is sanitary? A few months back we went to Mexico City for my daughter in law to run the marathon, ( finished in a little over 4 hours!). Anyway I tried to be safe and clean, while she and Charles ate from every street vendor booth they could find. They didn't really get sick either. They are both young, athletic, and incredibly strong and they eat healthier than I do, a lot of weird green stuff!

[Airmutt]

Wisconsin fall color can be quite spectacular but.....
September in WI is definitely one of those transition months, can go either way. Last year folks were praying for an early frost to kill off the hoards of mosquitoes, not the two engine types. Hiring all of the temp help would be a challenge too.

Last I heard there was no virus detected in the Fox River Valley area. Unfortunately AV has such a large draw the risk is someone coming from a more active area. Quite honestly I think the probability of the virus burning itself out or a vaccine developed and available by then is low so the government prohibition on large events will still be in effect. Hope for the best.

I would think if they can’t get it in by say Labor Day we’re done for the year.

[robert l]

Well it seems there's only one person of this forum that is informed and educated enough to make a rational decision, so here's an idea. All us comon folk that have a life insurance policy or savings account, go ahead and cash that sucker in, 'cause we're all gonna die in the very near future, if we even think about going out of the house. I think I'm going to have a big cook out, with some BBQ Possum, some squrriel, maybe some crow and of course dead pig, and invite the whole town. It will be our last hooray, then we can all go lie down and just fade away.
Bob, what cya gonna do !
PS, I'm still planning on A/V if it's on, but I'm not buying a ticket yet. (at least the last part makes sense)

[Airmutt]

Not me. I’m gonna wait until it’s officially cancelled. Then I’ll declare the zombie apocalypse officially in effect. The Plan: Spend the week of what should have been AV bing watching The Walking Dead with a healthy dose of old aviation movies.

In all seriousness, it’s a big country. Not all regions are being equally impacted. Societal behaviors should vary accordingly. The walkers in our subdivision have a unspoken double arms length rule and tend to gather in a giant school circle for chatting, that wouldn’t fly in NYC. Bottom line - Got to do what you think is best for yourself.
But let me know when you’re gonna throw that dead pig on the grill. I’ll bring some beer.:)

[robert l]

You got it Airmutt, you can even bring Corona Beer, I've got something in a Mason jar that will disarm it !!!
Bob, hope for the best, plan for the worst !

[Auburntsts]

Latest update on AirVenture planning. https://eaa.org/airventure/eaa-airventure-news-and-multimedia/eaa-airventure-news/eaa-airventure-oshkosh/03-26-2020-Looking-Ahead-to-AirVenture-2020
(https://eaa.org/airventure/eaa-airventure-news-and-multimedia/eaa-airventure-news/eaa-airventure-oshkosh/03-26-2020-Looking-Ahead-to-AirVenture-2020)
Looks like their decision point is in May.

[Dave Damitz]

I have to agree with you. I believe attendance will be down but the event will be held as normal.

[TinmanJones]

I have to agree with you. I believe attendance will be down but the event will be held as normal.

Man, now your speaking my language. I'm crossing my fingers this happens. It's a once in a lifetime for me and I'm all booked up to be there.

[Airmutt]

I appreciate your optimism but I bought my AV 2020 tee shirt today. I’m thinking that is gonna be a collectors item. I’m hoping I’m wrong.

[Floatsflyer]

Man, now your speaking my language. I'm crossing my fingers this happens. It's a once in a lifetime for me and I'm all booked up to be there.

Don't know where you're from, doesn't really matter, COVID 19 is everywhere and growing rapidly. Deaths are huge and getting huger.

But FYI and for others that harbour your thoughts and mindset. As of 1 hour ago the Wisconsin Dept. of Health Services confirmed 1391 cases of COVID-19, 130 more cases than yesterday's report. The Milwaukee Medical Examiner reported 10 and 16 deaths(no idea why the 2 seperate figures). Fox TV 6 reports 25 deaths. The Governor warns the numbers are expected to grow.

Of the confirmed cases, the Wisconsin Dept. of Health Services reports 53% are women, 47% male. By age group: 50's-18%; 60's-20%(most affected group); 70's-10%.

Since March 17, there has been a state-wide prohibition of all public gatherings of 10 or more to mitigate the spread. It is open-ended.

So, Tinman and others, as my 2 lawyer kids would say, WITHOUT PREJUDICE, GUIDE YOURSELF ACCORDINGLY.

[PaulDow]

Sun N’ Fun (Does the apostrophe go before or after the N?) has cancelled for this year.

[Kyle Boatright]

Sun N’ Fun (Does the apostrophe go before or after the N?) has cancelled for this year.

That was inevitable, IMO.

[Floatsflyer]

Sun N’ Fun (Does the apostrophe go before or after the N?) has cancelled for this year.

Paul, I can't find anything online, including the SunNFun site or on any of the major aviation sites that provides this news. You may have been confused by an online notice that said THE BASH(whatever this is?) as part of and under a logo of SnF was cancelled for 2020.

[Auburntsts]

their website has been updated:
(https://youtu.be/zXbmOpvxCOs)https://flysnf.org/a-message-from-john-leenhouts/

https://youtu.be/zXbmOpvxCOs

[FlyingRon]

No sun, no fun.

[Airmutt]

SNF was pretty much doomed from the start.

State or federal mandate will probably take the decision out of EAA’s hands. It’s probably more of a matter of when than if.

Georgia”s governor just ordered all schools and the university system “closed” for the remainder of the school year with online learning for everyone. My youngest granddaughter loves her kindergarten teacher and is just crushed. Additionally he has imposed a statewide open ended shelter in place order. I guess my passport to Porta Backyardia has renewed.

[GeorgeP]

Sun N’ Fun (Does the apostrophe go before or after the N?) has cancelled for this year.

I believe that it requires two apostrophes because two letters are missing from the word 'and'. IMO, it should be Sun 'n' Fun. Happy to be corrected. :D

[FlyinAdamBadger]

Actually it's SUN 'n FUN according to the USPTO. http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=doc&state=4803:k281wr.2.17

[Bill Berson]

Could be SUN an FUN or SUN in FUN.

[GeorgeP]

Actually it's SUN 'n FUN according to the USPTO. http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=doc&state=4803:k281wr.2.17Apologies, I am not a patent attorney and was only responding in the context of Her Majesty's English. ;) :D

[PaulDow]

I can see the EAA weekly eHotline that should be coming out later today:

Discussion Forums Popular Topics:
Quarantine Day 17 - Sun N Fun apostrophe

[rwanttaja]

Arlington has been cancelled.

https://www.arlingtonflyin.org/

Ron Wanttaja

[GeorgeP]

Arlington has been cancelled... (https://www.arlingtonflyin.org/) Sensible move.

[rwanttaja]

Arlington has been cancelled.

https://www.arlingtonflyin.org/Sensible move.
Washington State was hit early and hard by COVID-19, so there's a lot more caution here. IIRC, the first ~10 deaths in the US were in the Seattle area, and, of course Arlington is part of the metropolitan area.

Wisconsin has had fewer cases (a third of those of Washington, and less than 1% of the US's total) and residents may not feel the urgency. The effect of Georgia and Texas relaxing restrictions may not be apparent until the end of June.

Ron Wanttaja

[PaulDow]

Add the Hampton, NH Flea Market (May 16) http://hamptonairfield.com/
and the Bethpage NY Air Show (May 23 - 24) http://bethpageairshow.com/

to the cancellation list.

Also Old Rhinebeck Aerodrome Museum scheduled opening (May 1) has been delayed. Original schedule for shows to begin is June 21.