Where is the City of Oshkosh's Private Camp Ground Ordinance?

[Wrongway Feldman]

Do to the heavy rains Camp Scholler had to be closed.
And after seeing the back up of RVs and camper trailers on the 41 access roads in front of camp Scholler.
I started thinking about Oshkosh's Private Camp Ground Ordinance and if one actually exist.

And a couple questions arose.

How can the city of Oshkosh allow a Private Camp Ground be built without proper infrastructure.
1. Provide paved or graveled roads for the campers to be able to access their camp sites.
2. Provide a solid gravel driveway/parking pad for the RVs or camping trailers to park on.

Now I know Camp Scholler is not a full-time summer usage Camp Ground. But the City of Oshkosh's Private Camp Ground Ordinance may be lacking a bit. Considering what it may of cost EAA to park all those RVs and camper trailers at near-by privately owned business parking lots. EAA could have use those funds to put a dent into building a Camp Ground with proper infrastructure, For example: 1. & 2.

If you look at Wisconsin state parks they are built with the proper infrastructure, For example: 1. & 2.
But than again they are full-time usage Camp Ground.

What does the nearby Sleep Hollow camp ground infrastructure look like? probably, 1. & 2.

Rubber boot store sales must of been off the charts :-)

[troy_m]

I live in Oshkosh, and I don't recall ever seeing a specific camp ground ordinance. Regulations regarding camp grounds may be buried in some of their other ordinances. Any way, I believe Camp Scholler is not technically within the city limits of Oshkosh, it may be within either the town of Nekimi or the town of Black Wolf. If so, city of Oshkosh ordinances would not apply.

For reference, you can find the city of Oshkosh ordinances here: http://www.ci.oshkosh.wi.us/weblink/browse.aspx?startid=575047

[Dave Stadt]

Do to the heavy rains Camp Scholler had to be closed.
And after seeing the back up of RVs and camper trailers on the 41 access roads in front of camp Scholler.
I started thinking about Oshkosh's Private Camp Ground Ordinance and if one actually exist.

And a couple questions arose.

How can the city of Oshkosh allow a Private Camp Ground be built without proper infrastructure.
1. Provide paved or graveled roads for the campers to be able to access their camp sites.
2. Provide a solid gravel driveway/parking pad for the RVs or camping trailers to park on.

Now I know Camp Scholler is not a full-time summer usage Camp Ground. But the City of Oshkosh's Private Camp Ground Ordinance may be lacking a bit. Considering what it may of cost EAA to park all those RVs and camper trailers at near-by privately owned business parking lots. EAA could have use those funds to put a dent into building a Camp Ground with proper infrastructure, For example: 1. & 2.

If you look at Wisconsin state parks they are built with the proper infrastructure, For example: 1. & 2.
But than again they are full-time usage Camp Ground.

What does the nearby Sleep Hollow camp ground infrastructure look like? probably, 1. & 2.

Rubber boot store sales must of been off the charts :-)

I have been to many campgrounds private and municipal that did not provide either 1 or 2. Many folks camp to get away from pavement and gravel.

[Wrongway Feldman]

I keep hearing from EAA that "Without the volunteers AirVenture would not exist"
So its fair to say, that the volunteers are where EAA's bread and butter is at.

That said" I would say there is a high number of volunteers camping at camp Scholler, some a month before AirVenture starts. Wouldn't you think, that if EAA's greatest asset is staying at their campground, EAA would gold plate the roads and campsites.

If EAA's number one priority is not high quality camping accommodation for their number one asset, then all this talk, "Without the volunteers AirVenture would not exist" is becoming just lip service.

Hopefully The STUDY (https://www.eaa.org/en/airventure/eaa-airventure-news-and-multimedia/eaa-airventure-news/eaa-airventure-oshkosh/07-18-2019-Help-Improve-AirVenture-Traffic-Flow), that EAA has commissioned, will recommend high quality camping accommodation for their number one asset,The Volunteers and their members. (You must be a EAA member to purchase a campsite at EAA's camp Scholler)

WFRV Local 5 news, At 1:22 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2Q878mqPXM&t=82s) into video broadcast. Jack Pelton talks about the Northwestern University's Transportation Center to study.

Northwestern University video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_D03GWL2FDQ&feature=youtu.be) at Airventure 2019

Northwestern University Facebook (https://www.facebook.com/infoNUTC/?fref=mentions&__xts__[0]=68.ARBBytGDWONViNZ0KPS3FZ88yytcSQosIHTTlOStnG4mab KRu_ZmO_DwmMlYGTei4oUpOf3MNnBkXy0nhP1_1wq3bU5Iua6x zN29HywP_OOZJa3QzWZH1uFUaC7O_3fucYOVkeYTB7AIEQ2iCS LQrtmnjVpg5lkXyBonlhmu_5QTi4aOmneMvBaTxxcFYLdiqdcf rINGDX9sTLuYU4ZP-v_KEmBl3lBFJyeiF9R7HjMHsjwrh4kAAp_8h8_rCZoO7tQZhYs witUT5LJzstj56ZS2EB4hONyM9Xnug_FSx_6XUIU9ejhEQpCFn LU3HRnWfSq2EHWzHD3SVsIFWEkf86Jatw&__tn__=K-R)

Northwestern University twitter (https://twitter.com/InfoNUTC) scroll down to July 25th

FYI: Just remember those electric & water sites are close to $70 bucks per night, with no refund if you leave early.
And some people have prepaid days or weeks in advance to reserve those electric & water sites.
You pay the entire amount, for the site, from the date you reserve until the last day of AirVenture, regardless if you are onsite or not.

[CHICAGORANDY]

"
Hopefully The STUDY (https://www.eaa.org/en/airventure/eaa-airventure-news-and-multimedia/eaa-airventure-news/eaa-airventure-oshkosh/07-18-2019-Help-Improve-AirVenture-Traffic-Flow)
, that EAA has commissioned, will recommend high quality camping accommodation"

As I understand it, the N/W University Transportation study is studying pedestrian flow, buses and tram activities etc. I would be highly surprised if the study even mentioned the camping, beyond how folks travel to and from.

Perhaps I'm mistaken or you're engaging in 'wishful thinking'? lol

[Wrongway Feldman]

Perhaps I'm mistaken or you're engaging in 'wishful thinking'? lol
Ah, You're probably right, that study, when the results become public, will just be more lip service.
Then again, at the moment, My glass is half empty, but it can be Filled-up! lol

[Chris In Marshfield]

It’s a hay field that’s opened one or two times a year for us to pitch a tent. Where’s the problem again?

[Kyle Boatright]

It’s a hay field that’s opened one or two times a year for us to pitch a tent. Where’s the problem again?

Exactly. EAA can only afford to add and maintain a certain amount of infrastructure for an event that lasts one week on an annual basis. Domesticating the North, South, East, or West 40 just ain't gonna make the list.

[Wrongway Feldman]

.
You know what is kind of interesting.
I haven't yet heard anybody say, EAA AirVenture 2019 was hit by a once in a 100 years storm.

[krw920]

.
You know what is kind of interesting.
I haven't yet heard anybody say, EAA AirVenture 2019 was hit by a once in a 100 years storm.
There is always the option of, if you don't like the conditions, stay home. But that doesn't appear to be happening as more and more people seem to be coming each year!

[Bill Berson]

The important volunteers that did arrive early didn't have any problem. Check the weather first before arrival.

[Wrongway Feldman]

.
I can see for miles and miles and miles and miles and miles (https://twitter.com/FlyingandLife/status/1153028835379732490).

This video is unbelievable (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xlwgtp5lwh0&t=69s) !!

A couple more pics.
Pic 1 (https://scontent-ort2-2.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/67789327_10214944862438951_9025239590557974528_n.j pg?_nc_cat=104&_nc_oc=AQlAQDL3E-v4blOuIHVbYp0Rlbx92t7ioboUYi_HiECShcRqLfrU_OOvbnRI u4MucEc&_nc_ht=scontent-ort2-2.xx&oh=d9f1aa4eda6ea31a7fe72e67a80a3b4e&oe=5DE4F1E3)
Pic 2 (https://scontent-ort2-2.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/67317491_10156513988328321_7928511737244942336_n.j pg?_nc_cat=110&_nc_oc=AQmSxIuMZaX4jm3TCb7yqVX4_SeXnn_glr2deQgCiXB Y5tOJBn0e4A2LmggoCBjgs7k&_nc_ht=scontent-ort2-2.xx&oh=a8c42ba6ccbd68e2b27d17011cb170f3&oe=5DCBB610)

I'm just glad that nobody was hurt.

[deftone]

The important volunteers that did arrive early didn't have any problem. Check the weather first before arrival.

We arrived on Saturday and had to stay in a JCPenny parking lot until Tuesday. EAA doesnt have the funding to turn Scholler into a "proper" campsite, but rather than investing in so many improved sites, they could divert some of this spending into improvements on the roads, perhaps temporary matting that could be put down in wet spots when it rains, or gravel/rock?

[martymayes]

.
You know what is kind of interesting.
I haven't yet heard anybody say, EAA AirVenture 2019 was hit by a once in a 100 years storm.

So does that mean the next 99 yrs should be clear?

[stummers]

I survived shloshkosh 2010 and 2019. This year I heard that Oshkosh got 5" of rain in short period of time. This turned the camp ground into a muddy mess. I saw a large tractor pulling many stuck RVs to firmer ground. I saw trucks with pumps sucking up water to relocate it. I heard that attempts were made to supply the stranded campers with water and other supplies. In a short period of time we were dealing with dust everywhere. Then the roads were cleaned and treated. Mulch and gravel were used to dry and fill the major bogs. Great job EAA.

[dclaxon]

I think the calls for improving the campground to the point of being unaffected by this kind of storm would be way past the point of diminishing returns. I've only missed 1 AirVenture since '83, always staying in Scholler, (everything from a tent, to a small motorhome, a VW bus with a camper conversion, to my current preference of a pop-up trailer,) and all but a couple for the whole week. And this is only about the 3rd time it has been significantly affected by the weather. The 2010 and 2019 mentioned in the above post, and the time in the '90's that the whole midwest was under water. Just my opinion, but maybe people just need to stop trying to bring their homes with them, it's camping after all. and even that is only as low cost accommodations for the air show.
Dave

[krw920]

You should be out there this week for the Pathfinders Camporee! I would say it is about 90% tents covering all of Scholler! Looks like the South African camp on mega steroids!

[keen9]

So you want the Oshkosh city government to force EAA to spend money to improve the campground to some standard so you will feel safe or something?

EAA has made improvements every year. Throwing a bunch of pavement into the hay field that then consumes $$$$ to maintain sounds like a really bad idea. Stuff happens, and EAA dealt with it really well in both 2010 and 2019.

[Wrongway Feldman]

The other option is, they could do what they did at Woodstock back in 69'.
Chant - NO RAIN, NO RAIN, NO RAIN, NO RAIN ☮️

[Dave Stadt]

So you want the Oshkosh city government to force EAA to spend money to improve the campground to some standard so you will feel safe or something?

EAA has made improvements every year. Throwing a bunch of pavement into the hay field that then consumes $$$$ to maintain sounds like a really bad idea. Stuff happens, and EAA dealt with it really well in both 2010 and 2019.

Very true. In addition, adding pavement decreases land available to absorb water which increases flooding.

[N3kf]

So does that mean the next 99 yrs should be clear?Yea those once in 100 year storms in 2010 and 2019! Craps going to happen sometimes. Fortunately I stayed at the dorms in 2010, and managed to sneak into my site in 2019 on Saturday with my Class C after I caught the security person in a lie right before they closed it. Fortunately at the right place at the right time.

I do feel for the people that got put in the remote lots. But I think 2010 was worse. Hopefully they are getting some amount of refund....

But I understand there is not any way that the situation will be improved much for a one week event. They probably are getting away with it even not being called a campground, which adding infrastructure would probably change....

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk

[Wrongway Feldman]

A couple years ago when EAA moved the Fly Market and added Aviation Gateway Park.
They constructed roads and used a permeable or porous blacktop pavement to ward against flooding.
When it rains the porous blacktop pavement absorbs the water. You can Read about it HERE (https://omnni.com/omnnis-site-design-enhances-eaa-airventure-experience/)

[Bill Berson]

We arrived on Saturday and had to stay in a JCPenny parking lot until Tuesday. EAA doesnt have the funding to turn Scholler into a "proper" campsite, but rather than investing in so many improved sites, they could divert some of this spending into improvements on the roads, perhaps temporary matting that could be put down in wet spots when it rains, or gravel/rock?

So you parked on premium hard surface :) I imagine the bus ride was about the same as a bus ride from the far end of Scholler, problem solved.
EAA may not own the hay field, so no option to improve anyway.

[Kim]

It’s a hay field that’s opened one or two times a year for us to pitch a tent. Where’s the problem again?

Exactly!

[skyfixer8]

.
You know what is kind of interesting.
I haven't yet heard anybody say, EAA AirVenture 2019 was hit by a once in a 100 years storm.

That was a "once in 100 year storm" ? Been going there for about 25 years (give or take) and I can remember a lot of those storms and gust fronts.