AirVenture 2018

[robert l]

I started my count down on 5/20/17 and now there's only 322 days until the day before AirVenture starts ! If all goes as planned we will have a plane to fly and arrive the day before opening day. Of course that could change, we may be two days early or two days late. Anyway, I think about it a lot. LOL !
Bob

[Jeff Point]

So I'm not the only one. Good to know!

[Kyle Boatright]

So I'm not the only one. Good to know!

There's a long list...

[mazdaP5]

If there are planes I'll be there.

[robert l]

Of course my wife thinks I'm crazy because I'll plan out a trip for my flying buddy and me to Sun N Fun or AirVenture to the ength degree but if she and I take a vacation I'm like, ok, whatever !
Bob

[CHICAGORANDY]

Counting the days is a VERY popular pastime - lol - Go on any of the popular travel websites and try to find an 'affordable' room anywhere even near Oshkosh for 7/21-29/2018. Even that dumpy Motel 6 in Oshkosh (and based on the reviews it really is a dump) is commanding over $170 a night.

[gbrasch]

Jeff Point has a luxury camper he might rent out if the price is right.
PS: Jeff, you need to update your signature and show off that Breezy!

[CHICAGORANDY]

I booked my motel the day I got home from this year's event. $60 a night for the 8 nights but it's 46 miles away.

[Skyguy]

Chigagorandy;;Motel 6 charges $259 with tax....a little more than you mentioned....always the tax..

[CHICAGORANDY]

Quite the bargain eh? lol

[Skyguy]

Chicagorandy;

Several years ago while standing in EAA line, I recognizedthe person next to me….an EAA Board Member.

I told this board member that during the off season….theboard needed to visit each motel and tell them to “knock off the price gouging”.The EAA Board Member replied…”stay in the dorm”….which I replied…. ”you stay inthe dorm & I will stay in your house”.

Silence.

[Kyle Boatright]

Chicagorandy;

Several years ago while standing in EAA line, I recognizedthe person next to me….an EAA Board Member.

I told this board member that during the off season….theboard needed to visit each motel and tell them to “knock off the price gouging”.The EAA Board Member replied…”stay in the dorm”….which I replied…. ”you stay inthe dorm & I will stay in your house”.

Silence.


Can't control the free market.

[Mayhemxpc]

The dorm isn't all that cheap, either -- especially the ones with air conditioning. But it is a lot cheaper than the hotels.

Wife informed me last week that she is coming to AV2018. (She normally only goes every other year.) Two reasons: She convinced one of her high school friends to come and bring he father (bucket list item); and she spent about half the time at AV2017 volunteering at the forums and she liked it.

[CHICAGORANDY]

"Special Event" pricing is common everywhere and has existed near forever. I recall reading tales of the days of the Gold Rush in California and Alaska and seeing pictures of prices on all foods, lodging and mining gear going for astronomical prices. I won't begrudge the local Oshkosh vendors, especially those owning the very limited housing in the area, from pricing according to what the market will bear. I simply marvel at the monetary level the market does indeed bear.

Quite honestly, I couldn't be a volunteer at the 'under 30 mile' motel rates that AirVenture commands. But as I always say in this life, so many things are NOT too expensive...I just can't afford them.

[Cary]

Any wonder I camp with my airplane? $27 a day seems bargainish compared to motels etc. Granted, no air-conditioning, but over the last dozen years, that's not been much of a problem other than a couple nights a few years ago, when daytime temps climbed to 100F. A fan has always made it quite bearable for sleeping. The showers are adequate, as are other necessary facilities, for campers. And the camaraderie among the campers is hard to beat.

Cary

[malexander]

I still like camping with my motorhome at Sleepy Hollow Farm. There's a few airplane people there too. :)

[robert l]

I still like camping with my motorhome at Sleepy Hollow Farm. There's a few airplane people there too. :)
I camped at Sleepy Hollow in 2011 and really enjoyed it. The only thing I didn't like was the long walk, other than that, it was great.

[malexander]

I camped at Sleepy Hollow in 2011 and really enjoyed it. The only thing I didn't like was the long walk, other than that, it was great.

Robert: They do have a shuttle that runs back and forth.

[robert l]

Robert: They do have a shuttle that runs back and forth.
Yes, we caught the shuttle a couple of times but my flying buddy is a bit impatient, so we walked a bunch even when we could have ridden the trams. That was in 2011, last year I got him to calm down a bit and wait for the trams. I had to pull rank, (age) on him. I said, remember, I'm 70 and you're 44, I ain't freakin' walking anymore, if you can't wait 10 min. I'll see you back at camp ! On one instance we were going by the camp store before heading back to the tent, he elected to walk and I rode the tram. I guess in was a good 15 minutes and I beat him to the store, you should have seen the look on his face. He's a great guy, a great pilot, a great friend and he's like a son but he is a little anal sometimes !!! Oh, he and I will be flying into AirVenture in 2018 !!!
Bob

[Joda]

Several years ago while standing in EAA line, I recognized the person next to me….an EAA Board Member.

I told this board member that during the off season….the board needed to visit each motel and tell them to “knock off the price gouging”. The EAA Board Member replied…”stay in the dorm”….which I replied…. ”you stay in the dorm & I will stay in your house”.

EAA has no input or oversight of what individual hotel owners/managers decide to charge for their hotel rooms. It's classic supply and demand at work. Whatever the market will bear. So, as long as people continue to fill the hotels at the rates they're charging, the rates will stay where they are. The only recourse is for people to stop booking the hotels. Then the rates would come down until the hotels were full again. But I don't think that's likely to happen, so complaining to an EAA board member isn't going to have any real effect, other than possibly making you somehow feel better.

[CarlOrton]

I've told this previously, but since the context is about hotels, I'll relate it again.

In January 2008, my wife and I attended a Sonex Workshop at Oshkosh. January. We stayed at the Hilton. Now, up to this time, my wife never attended Convention. After the first day of the workshop, and after talking with the other spouses, she says to me, as we're heading back to the hotel, "How 'bout I attend this year?" After swerving on the snow covered street in disbelief, I looked at her, and she followed it up with, "As long as we can stay at the Hilton." I laugh and tell her fat chance. She didn't believe me when I said there was no way you could even get *in* to the Hilton, let alone the price. As she's mocking me for being a Donnie Downer, we walk into the lobby. I lean on the counter, point to my wife, and tell the desk clerk, "My wife wants to make a reservation here during Convention." Clerk says, "What year?" My wife says, "This year, of course!" And the clerk then says, "We're booked 3 years out for that week! And that rate is $xxx (can't remember, but it was very high)" Ohhhhh.

So we stay in the a/c dorms at UWO. Which ain't cheap either at $125/night for a college dorm with no bathroom or shower (down the hall). But, she's attended every year with me since 2008 and has a blast. I don't even see her during the day - usually only when we get back to the dorm. She's into history and warbirds, I'm into homebuilding, technology, etc. She's ridden the Tri-Motor and Helicopter by herself. She's also met some truly interesting folks who just stopped to offer her a ride in their golf carts!

After the first year, we stayed at a Holiday Inn Express the night before our flight out of MKE (early flight). She walks into the room and exclaims, I never thought I'd look at a HI as luxurious, but after that week in the dorms, I'm in heaven!

[krw920]

So we stay in the a/c dorms at UWO. Which ain't cheap either at $125/night for a college dorm with no bathroom or shower (down the hall).

There are other options than the dorms or hotels. Check out the private listings here. https://stayeaa.com/find-private-housing/

For $125 a night you would get the almost the entire lower level of my home in Omro to yourselves.

[CarlOrton]

There are other options than the dorms or hotels. Check out the private listings here. https://stayeaa.com/find-private-housing/

For $125 a night you would get the almost the entire lower level of my home in Omro to yourselves.

Thanks, but we're spoiled with the dorms. Don't have to stand in line to park in some far-out remote lot, we can all head back to the dorm (we have about 3 rooms with friends) at our own times, etc. Couldn't do that with just one rental car. Just hop the bus back to the dorm. We have in fact contemplated renting a house (since there *is* a group of us...), but the transportation logistics just didn't work out. I like to hit the grounds extra early, my wife likes to show up around 10, and the others are more of a 9 am arrival group.

[robert l]

Well, sad news today. Looks like we aren't going to have the 172 available for A/V 2018. But, there may be a chance to partner up with someone with a Bonanza but that adds another person and everyone wants there own tent. Privacy thing I guess, snoring, farting, restless sleep I guess are big issues ! It would be a lot faster but with 3 of everything it's going to fill up the available space pretty quick, we'll see. And then there is the option of driving the almost 2000 mi. round trip again. UUUGGGHHHH !!! Well, at least we've got plenty of time to see what's going to work best.
Bob

[mazdaP5]

Well, sad news today. Looks like we aren't going to have the 172 available for A/V 2018. But, there may be a chance to partner up with someone with a Bonanza but that adds another person and everyone wants there own tent. Privacy thing I guess, snoring, farting, restless sleep I guess are big issues ! It would be a lot faster but with 3 of everything it's going to fill up the available space pretty quick, we'll see. And then there is the option of driving the almost 2000 mi. round trip again. UUUGGGHHHH !!! Well, at least we've got plenty of time to see what's going to work best.
Bob

Surely you could build an Air Camper by then?

[robert l]

Surely you could build an Air Camper by then?

I like the way you think Mazda !

[Bill Greenwood]

Carl, the rate for the Hilton last time I checked a year ago was $475, so makes the week over $3500 after tax. I have stayed at the Hilton for a day or two just outside the convention week and its not only a good hotel but its location is hard to beat. I used to know someone who worked for Hilton so got a day or two at a normal rate of $175 but they couldn't do that during the week and they don't work there now. The rooms are a little noisy, and the food is ok, better than much of Oshkosh, but not really great. One type club I belong to moved their meeting away as the catered food one year was awful as was the service. Hilton had tried to do it themselves. The folks at the bar are often nice, I used to see
Bob Hoover there every year. I tried staying at the dorm one year but it was bad, too hot to sleep with no a c and they didn't furnish any sheets at all, maybe that's ok if you are driving in, but even the rankest hotel I ever stayed in had sheets, maybe with a few bullet holes. Many folks say the food is pretty good at the dorms, but I've found a lot of EAA folks are not very discerning on food. How else could they sell cheese curds or whatever. Lots of people tout staying in a hotel an hour or more away, but not the same as being nearby to me.

[Floatsflyer]

Research and yee shall find reasonable rates between 25-50 minutes north of Oshkosh. I've said it many times before here and so I'll say it again. For years we stayed in Green Bay at the Ramada for under $80.00 per night including a full daily breakfast.

Three years ago we decided to get closer and found a terrific brand name hotel for under $100.00 per night including a full breakfast daily in Appleton just off interstate 41.

We continue to fly into Green Bay, leave the plane with Jet Air and rent a Malibu for about $220.00/wk.

[Bill Berson]

Where did you find a car in Green Bay for $220 for the week?

[Floatsflyer]

Where did you find a car in Green Bay for $220 for the week?

At one of the major car rentals, been dealing with them for many years. You sound skeptical. I'd be happy to meet you on the Osh grounds and show you the invoice.

[CHICAGORANDY]

Is that before or after taxes and fees? I see plenty of Enterprise compacts at the Green Bay airport for about $250 but the taxes etc bump that up to $325 or there abouts.

[Floatsflyer]

All in.

[CHICAGORANDY]

Sweet deal...... I drive up each year and stay about 50 miles from KOSH in a room that's $60 a nite all in. Also a good deal. There ARE ways to attend that are more 'economical' than others, but nobody ever claimed AirVenture was 'cheap' fun. lol

[Bill Berson]

At one of the major car rentals, been dealing with them for many years. You sound skeptical. I'd be happy to meet you on the Osh grounds and show you the invoice.
Which one?
I reserved a car early in September with Hertz at Green Bay for around $195 for the week of July 2015. But then in June 2015 Hertz sent my confirmation with a price increase to $750. I cancelled after getting no help or response from a manager. Nothing reasonable from others either at that late date.
So I am interested in who you deal with?

[Floatsflyer]

Sorry Bill, I'm not telling you because I don't want the same thing to happen to me. If you think I'm a schmuck for that then so be it. What happened to you with Hertz is the same disgusting thing that happened to Chicago Randy with a hotel reservation in Appleton last year.

I've never experienced anything like this with advanced confirmed in writing bookings being cancelled in favour of gouging practices to hike rates. Maybe these f**kers don't want to f**k with Canadians!

[Bill Berson]

Are you suggesting to ask for a confirmed reservation in writing instead of Internet? Does that require prepayment?

[Floatsflyer]

With respect to any kind of advanced reservations by phone or internet, my experience has always been to receive a written email confirmation setting out complete transaction details including, of course, the $ rate. As a consumer, you need to rely on any booking you've made and that email is your proof of it. I never authorized any prepayment and I'm positive none was ever asked for but they will always ask for your credit card number to hold the reservation-that's normal practice as you know.

The actual charge to my credit card does not happen until I return the car. I don't trust car rental companies because of all their nefarious add-ons and nonsense fees so I never just drop off the car in the lot. I proceed to the desk and ask the staffer to come out to the car and sign off that it has been returned with no damage. Then I finalize the charges to my satisfaction and only then do they process the card and I receive the final invoice. I've got nothing but time, I'm flying my own airplane.

[Bill Berson]

I don't trust them either. I had the original email confirmation but didn't want to have to sue them to make them honor it.
So many ways they can get you. On my last rental I made sure to ask the car return agent if he found it clean, properly fueled and without damage. He said:"yes, yes, yes" . He gave me a receipt and I left. Later I found that receipt was for a different vehicle so was useless. Then the next day they called and said I returned the vehicle a day late and billed my card another $78.
I filed a complaint with VISA card. Took three months of back and forth before I won.

I hate rentals.

[CHICAGORANDY]

Same deal here - written e-mail confirmation was useless in getting them to honor the quoted room rate. No pre-payment and I didn't want the financial hassle of suing them. I HAVE of course placed Super 8 Appleton at the top of my fecal roster.

[robert l]

A questionfor anyone that has flown into AirVenture and stayed at the dorms. There may be 3 of us flying in next year andstaying in a dorm but there are only two beds in the dorm so we will have to take a cot.That’s not a problem but what about getting the cot and all our stuff to thedorm from airplane parking? Will we have to lug all our stuff to a tramlocation to get a ride to the dorm shuttle location? Just trying to get a headsup with some pre planning.
Bob

[FlyingRon]

First off, there are city buses from the main gate area to the dorms. Where are you parking during the show (what sort of airplane?). There are also a few courtesy shuttles that can get you from your plane direct to the dorm.

[dewi8095]

A question for anyone that has flown into AirVenture and stayed at the dorms. There may be 3 of us flying in next year and staying in a dorm but there are only two beds in the dorm so we will have to take a cot[/FONT].

Robt:

There is no place to put a cot in a two-person dorm room. The dorm rooms I have stayed in have two single beds against the wall, there is a microwave and small refrigerator between the beds, study carrels at the foot of the beds, then a small chest of drawers and some shelving above the chests. These rooms are literally "walk in and back out." In my opinion, you will need two of these rooms for three people, or, one of the larger rooms that sleeps four. In either case you can leave the cot home.

Don

[robert l]

Ron, if we end up flying it will be a Beachcraft Bonanza and if we go to the dorms I'm assuming we would park in general aircraft parking.
And dewi, the young lady I talked with said it was ok to put a cot in a dorm room, she didn't say however that it would be that crowded. If it's going to be that bad we may as well make the 900 plus mile drive and camp. But who knows, different options may come up by then, after all, it's still 249 days before opening day.
Bob
Bob

[dewi8095]

Bob:

The dorm rooms I have stayed in (Taylor Hall, I believe), are adequate, but not all that comfortable, the only place to sit in them is on one of the beds or the chairs at the study carrels, the bathrooms are down the hall, and there is no water in the rooms. I have always marveled at the university's ability to get students to stay in them! Limited, and as expensive, as they are, they still are not a bad choice for AirVenture. Taylor Hall (an air conditioned dorm) is a close walk to the dining facility which does a decent job with its food and the buses to the AirVenture grounds are right in front of the the dining facility. The early morning buses are crowded, but they are better than fighting the traffic and paying the parking costs at AirVenture. The non air conditioned dorms may be more commodious, I have not stayed in one.

Don

[Cary]

Ron, if we end up flying it will be a Beachcraft Bonanza and if we go to the dorms I'm assuming we would park in general aircraft parking.
And dewi, the young lady I talked with said it was ok to put a cot in a dorm room, she didn't say however that it would be that crowded. If it's going to be that bad we may as well make the 900 plus mile drive and camp. But who knows, different options may come up by then, after all, it's still 249 days before opening day.
Bob
Bob

If camping is one of your options, why not just plan that from the get-go, and camp with your airplane? It’s a great experience, camping with fellow aviation nuts, making new friends, seeing old friends, and airplanes! There’s no better alarm clock than a pair of Mustangs taking off at 6:05 for the dawn patrol!

Cary

[FlyingRon]

If it is a 1970 or earlier plane, you can park in Vintage. Ask whoever parks you to ask them to get Tony's Taxi. This is a free service on a time available basis. It's not a vintage operation, but the vintage parking guys have a direct line into them so it's easy. Alternatively, you can always call the real OSHKOSH CAB. They know where the access points on the field are. I used to have them in my cell phone back in the day.

[robert l]

I appreciate all the responses, I did not know about the taxis. If we do camp we will be driving up so we can have a decent tent, complete with cots and self inflating mattress like we did last year. At 71 and knee replacement coming after the first of the year, I ain't crawling in and out of a 3 foot tall tent ! Been there, done that at SNF 2015 when we camped with the plane, ain't happening anymore !!! I can put up with a lot to experience MECA but the list gets smaller the older I get.
Bob

[Cary]

Uh, FWIW, I camp with my 63 P172D in a stand up 4 person tent, on a cot with a nice thick Thermarest mattress. I have tables and chairs and coolers and stoves. I also bring an extra cot and mattress for any guest I may have during the week. The majority of the tents in airplane camping are large ones. Fly-in camping doesn’t require backpacking-like austerity.

Oh, BTW, I’ll be 74 tomorrow. For a single overnight, a crawl-in tent is acceptable, but for a week, I also like stretch-out comfort.

Cary

[FlyingRon]

After 20 years of camping at Oshkosh, we've settled on the 8 person Cabela's Artic Guide domes. I am 6'1'+ and standing up in the middle is not a problem.
Admittedly, we don't "fly" in the camp gear anymore. It stays in a storage locker off the field until we get up there.

[Kyle Boatright]

...The majority of the tents in airplane camping are large ones. Fly-in camping doesn’t require backpacking-like austerity.

Oh, BTW, I’ll be 74 tomorrow. For a single overnight, a crawl-in tent is acceptable, but for a week, I also like stretch-out comfort.

Cary

Different strokes for different folks. In the homebuilt camping area, there are a lot of 2-3 person ultralight camping tents, just because the (mainly) two seat attendees are on a pretty strict budge for weight and cubic volume they can carry in the airplane along with a friend and all of the gear necessary to be sorta-comfortable for several days/nights.

[robert l]

Uh, FWIW, I camp with my 63 P172D in a stand up 4 person tent, on a cot with a nice thick Thermarest mattress. I have tables and chairs and coolers and stoves. I also bring an extra cot and mattress for any guest I may have during the week. The majority of the tents in airplane camping are large ones. Fly-in camping doesn’t require backpacking-like austerity.

Oh, BTW, I’ll be 74 tomorrow. For a single overnight, a crawl-in tent is acceptable, but for a week, I also like stretch-out comfort.

Cary
Happy Birthday Cary, more power to you and I hope you get to enjoy many more AirVentures ! In comfort !
Bob

[Cary]

Different strokes for different folks. In the homebuilt camping area, there are a lot of 2-3 person ultralight camping tents, just because the (mainly) two seat attendees are on a pretty strict budge for weight and cubic volume they can carry in the airplane along with a friend and all of the gear necessary to be sorta-comfortable for several days/nights.
That’s the one area I haven’t camped in. But I’ve seen some pretty big camps beside some pretty small airplanes in the other areas, and the universal answer seems to be UPS, except for some folks I met last year, from the Chicago area, who were camped beside me. He flew his home-built 2 seater, and she drove their SUV with all the camping gear aboard! :)

Cary

[Mayhemxpc]

That’s the one area I haven’t camped in. But I’ve seen some pretty big camps beside some pretty small airplanes in the other areas, and the universal answer seems to be UPS, except for some folks I met last year, from the Chicago area, who were camped beside me. He flew his home-built 2 seater, and she drove their SUV with all the camping gear aboard! :)

Cary

That is what my family does, but we come in from Northern Virginia. I fly with one son, the tent, and personal gear in case ground support is delayed. The mother unit drives in with the mini-van, other son, and remaining ground support: field kitchen, cots, and remaining camping -- sorry, "glamping" gear she insists on.

[FlyingRon]

Ten of us share a locker just off the field. Packing in and out got a lot better when we standardized on a single size bin:

https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/20638534_10209712625283407_949459779845607862_n.jp g?oh=fc3607acb193ee6abf7b36b28fc3a57a&oe=5A9B59B3

[Cary]

That is what my family does, but we come in from Northern Virginia. I fly with one son, the tent, and personal gear in case ground support is delayed. The mother unit drives in with the mini-van, other son, and remaining ground support: field kitchen, cots, and remaining camping -- sorry, "glamping" gear she insists on.
Glamping is good! :)

Cary

[robert l]

Ten of us share a locker just off the field. Packing in and out got a lot better when we standardized on a single size bin:

https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/20638534_10209712625283407_949459779845607862_n.jp g?oh=fc3607acb193ee6abf7b36b28fc3a57a&oe=5A9B59B3
How do you get your stuff from storage to your camp site ? This sounds like a great idea for flying in and camping. Do you camp with your plane ?
Bob

[FunInAviation]

We just bought this 31ft 2005 Coachmen RV and are getting it ready for Oshkosh! So far, everything works great. Drove it to Norman OK for the AOPA Fly-in.

I've got an AirVenture logo and Countdown timer on my RV (recreational vehicle that is) website: https://thisnewoldrv.com/

6780

[FlyingRon]

How do you get your stuff from storage to your camp site ? This sounds like a great idea for flying in and camping. Do you camp with your plane ?
Bob
We have a few people in the coop that drive up. Either that or I borrow a truck from one of the Oshkosh-area locals who volunteer with us.

[robert l]

Well, it appears we will have a pop up camper to make the almost 1000 mile trip with us next year. My buddy has (supposedly) secured a camper for us but I have yet to see it. I would like to make sure we know how to put it up and down without doing any damage plus, I want to make sure it's clean. On another note, I will be having knee replacement on the 23rd of January so I will have almost a full 6 months before AirVenture 2018, I think that should be enough. Anyway, as for now, "It's on like a pot of smoked neck bones" !
Bob

[robert l]

Well, it's official, I'm having knee replacement surgery on Jan. 23, 2018. At some point before then I will re-visit the surgeon to get all the details and I'm going to ask about getting an injection for my other knee about a week before Airventure. That's what I've been doing the past couple of years but now that that knee is going to be fixed, I'll start getting shots in the (good, ha, ha) knee. Also, just had injections in my back for sciatic pain but won't know how it's working for another week. I will have almost 6 mos. recovery before Airventure so I figure I'll be good to go. Still working on the camper thing.
Bob

[mazdaP5]

Well, it's official, I'm having knee replacement surgery on Jan. 23, 2018. At some point before then I will re-visit the surgeon to get all the details and I'm going to ask about getting an injection for my other knee about a week before Airventure. That's what I've been doing the past couple of years but now that that knee is going to be fixed, I'll start getting shots in the (good, ha, ha) knee. Also, just had injections in my back for sciatic pain but won't know how it's working for another week. I will have almost 6 mos. recovery before Airventure so I figure I'll be good to go. Still working on the camper thing.
Bob

Good luck!

[Skyguy]

How about a dirigible again for 2018 ? I know EAA reads this. What say ?

[robert l]

Well I think I have it figured out. I bought a 1975 Apache hard side pop up camper, "NO CANVAS" ! (Bad experience years ago with canvas pop up, it rained and although it didn't leak, the condensation kept everything damp. Sleeping bag, clothes, towels, everything !) It's not fancy but I think it will serve the purpose. Going to get new tires, repack the wheel bearings and make sure it's road worthy. One of the pilots at the local airport has dubbed it, "The Oshkosh Hilton". I think he's making fun of it. LOL
Bob