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View Full Version : Asking a Really big favor from anyone that might be interested...



avinuts
03-12-2014, 12:40 PM
I am an amateur/hobbiest aspiring photographer that has attended the EAA in Oshkosh since 1974. I have been flying since I was 16 years old and have been around long enough to know a few of the "do's and don'ts. I have always been a big Warbird fan and even volunteered to work the fuel truck back in the old days. I would like to ask permission to photograph a few Warbird aircraft ealy in the morning during the week at EAA (about two hours). Yes, I don't touch without asking and hopefully having the owner present. I anticipate using two of my favorite things in the shoot, beautiful aircraft and beautiful girls. I would like to get some "wing and cockpit" photos with the model if possible. The photos are not sold and I do not get paid or make any money on this venture. The model gets free admission from me in trade for her time. As the owner/pilot, you would receive edited photo(s) of the model with your aircraft emailed to you after the show. Any interest would be sincerely appreciated. Thanks, Mike.

Mayhemxpc
03-12-2014, 02:53 PM
I just have a lowly O-2A (with 14 bullet-hole patches) but I plan on being there all week, and I usually am on the line myself shortly about dawn, gawking at the other airplanes in that beautiful light and pre-crowd peace. So, if that interests you, I will be there.

Chris Mayer
N424AF
www.o2cricket.com

avinuts
03-13-2014, 03:57 AM
Thank you for the offer. No such thing as a lowly warbird. I will be in touch as things get closer and become more finalized. Very much appreciated. Mike

bdk
03-14-2014, 04:29 PM
You might want to ask EAA first. I was wandering around outside in the "public" area outside the fenced off warbirds area taking night shots of Rudy Frasca's Spitfire and was chased away by some "warbirds security" folks in a golf cart. I guess the warbirds see a lot of vandalism from people who stealthily flash camera strobes in the night. I was told I couldn't be there even though it wasn't fenced off and there were no signs. This was some time ago so things may have changed, but seldom do they change for the better in my experience.

Yes Zack, I'm still complaining about this... ;)

avinuts
03-15-2014, 01:57 PM
Thanks for the info...

avinuts
03-18-2014, 06:32 AM
Plan to shoot in daylight with grounds open and owner/pilot present. Should hopefully prevent any security problems. Request was posted in EAA email newsletter this month without comment. Thanks Mike

avinuts
07-03-2014, 06:54 AM
I have been fortunate to have received some offers from gracious warbird owners, but now as EAA gets closer, I would like to request again, permission to shoot (photograph) warbirds with models early in the morning on Tuesday or Wednesday. Thank you in advance. Mike

flibmeister
07-03-2014, 12:27 PM
I have been fortunate to have received some offers from gracious warbird owners, but now as EAA gets closer, I would like to request again, permission to shoot (photograph) warbirds with models early in the morning on Tuesday or Wednesday. Thank you in advance. Mike

I am an air show air boss, and your posts reminded my of an incident that occurred at one of my shows:

We had a photographer make a request similar to yours, but he didn't mention the models. With permission granted (there was actually an official "dawn patrol" photo op offered by show organizers), he was allowed onto the hot ramp in the early morning, and started shooting photos. Some of those photos included shots of a nude or nearly nude young woman posing on and around the West Coast Viper Team F-16, and in those shots all sorts of identifying information about the aircraft unit and crew could be seen-- including the pilot's name painted beneath the canopy.

Someone with authority (airport manager?) came onto the airport as this was happening, and the next thing you know there's a meeting going on involving the photographer, the airport manager, the air show director, the pilot and crew chief of the F-16, airport security-- and, on conference call, an Air Force general. It became a HUGE brouhaha, with the Air Force threatening to pull the Viper team from the show, the photographer and the model threatened with violation of various state and federal statutes, etc. The pilot and crew chief were particularly upset, they believed that any publication of the photos, anywhere, would be career enders for them.

It was eventually resolved when the photographer agreed to surrender the memory card containing the photos, which was destroyed. If he uploaded them to the cloud or had other backups, he must have been sufficiently intimidated, because the pics have never turned up anywhere that I'm aware of.

So, if permission is granted for you to take such photos at Airventure, the Thunderbirds and other military airplanes may be a tempting target-- but if you'd like to avoid a similar confrontation, I'd stick with civilian-owned warbirds.

avinuts
07-04-2014, 06:50 AM
Thanks for the advice. This and all input from those with previous experiences are sincerely apppreciated. It is unfortunate that at a great event like this, most of the help received was/is in the form of negative information. There seems to be a lot more information out there as to why I can't/shouldn't do this rather than providing a "controlled" situation where it can happen. The Thunderbirds will be parked by Basler when they are there, which will be the last weekend of the show. Most "military" aircraft when on static display are located at Conoco Plaza. The Warbirds area is for those aircraft that may be privately owned or provided by some organization. My original request was mearly for "permission" from owners to shoot thier aircraft early to mid week. There is no nudity involved. This is a family oriented venue and believe me, I do respect that along with someones aircraft. You will probably be less likely to see me shooting my photos, than the thousands of other amateur photogrphers that week taking pictures of thier wives and girlfriends without any "controls". I don't sell the photos, make calendars or profit from them in any way. Perhaps you are right, maybe it's just not worth trying to do it the right way....

TedK
07-06-2014, 06:51 AM
The Thunderbirds will be parked by Basler when they are there, which will be the last weekend of the show.
Will they? They show manual would seem to suggest they will be parked at show center.

Bill Greenwood
07-06-2014, 10:18 AM
Mike, just come to warbirds at the first of the week, and meet some folks, and ask politely. Best to come early in the morning when the flight line is open and pilots are not busy with the briefing for the show. If you meet me, I can introduce you to some of the folks, but really don't need me. Now don't have a thin skin, you may ask 5 people and get 3 no's, but just persist politely. I used to go every year to the ultralight area and beg/bargain for a ride. Got some No s, but got a ride almost every year.
I don't have a warbird there this year, or you would be welcome to use mine.
As for models, there is a famous warbird calender , based I think in Dallas with some great looking girls in the Vargas style and with warbirds.
I don't know of any pilots that don't like ladies, but I can't speak for all these jet guys who ride around in air conditioned cockpits. To each his own. And pilots/owners almost always like to have good photos of their planes, and sometimes are too busy to take em themselves.
If you were using my plane, I'd have to supervise and the less clothes the model wears the closer I'd have to supervise to make sure she doesn't hit any sharp or hot parts.

We just had a 1930s/1940s style dance at Boulder airport with many people in vintage costumes, some of which were pretty small. There were lots of photos taken of girls up on the wing of a twin Beech, etc, and everyone had a good time. In 32 years of being around warbirds I have never heard or seen of anyone objecting to sharp ladies being photographed with hot planes. As far as using a F-16 rather than something classic, that is a matter of taste.

avinuts
07-07-2014, 07:18 AM
Will they? They show manual would seem to suggest they will be parked at show center.

You may very well be right. I'm not involved with keeping up to almost daily changes. Past experience indicates that even if they are parked at show center just prior to the performance, they WILL NOT be accessable to the public. Usually they are in an area that can be seen by the public as part of the performance with ground crews and "precission" run-ups. Thanks!

avinuts
07-07-2014, 07:38 AM
Bill, thank you for the very kind offer. I'm sorry to hear that your "warbird" will not be attending this year. I have always been a fan of those vintage aircraft, nose art and the ladies who inspire us with the Vargas, Petty, Elvgrin and Frahm styles. Don't be suprised if I DO look you up, and YES, you are more than welcome to help "supervise". Thanks, Mike.

P.S. I've always thought that it was better to mentor than discourage the next generation. We attend car shows and always let young people sit in our car. The same policy has been used for local fly-ins with kids and our rental aircraft. Just seems to be a lot more fun "sharing".

avinuts
07-14-2014, 11:50 AM
Bill where is a "good" place to find you in Warbirds?
Thanks!