Cancellation of AeroPlanner Services for EAA members

[sgfreeman]

:(
For the EAA- please provide an explanation why I received an email that AeroPlanner services are being terminated for EAA members. It would have been nice to see something from the EAA with some explanation instead of a 2 week notice from Aeroplanner. Is there going to be any replacement flight planning service available to members or will we have to purchase the service on our own? It is one of the main reasons I am a member of EAA, so I hope there will be some type of communication with additional information before the 17th when all our flight plans will be lost if we don't pay the big bucks to join Aeroplanner.
Thanks.

[flyingriki]

It was a lousy planner. Not much left out there for free except Seattle Avionics basic freebie and AOPA's. That is, if you like graphic with good detail, VFR, easy to adjust routing etc.
Please - not trying to start another rant fest on flight planners.....!

[Charlie Becker]

sgfreeman,

Due to the extremely low utilization of Aeroplanner by our members and the proliferation of free (and fee-based) online flight planners, we decided that it no longer made sense for us to try and maintain our own EAA-branded version of Aeroplanner. Unfortunately, Aeroplanner has never shared the list of registered EAA users so we could not personally inform our members of the coming change. We offered to do a joint communication but they opted to send their notice without our input. We are considering our options for a replacement.

Here is a list of some popular free online flight planning resources:

1. DUATS http://duats.com/
2. Runwayfinder.com http://runwayfinder.com/
3. Flightplan.com http://www.fltplan.com/
4. Skyvector http://skyvector.com/
5. Duats Voyager http://www.seattleavionics.com/duatvoyager.aspx
6. Navplan.com http://www.navplan.com/ (http://www.navplan.com/)

[S3flyer]

And 1a -- GoldenEagle FlightPrep (downloadable from duats.com)

[vaflier]

I really like navmonster. It gives you weather info And everything else you may want all on one site. Check it out at navmonster.com

[EDGEFLY]

For Charlie Becker:

OK, it is clear that mismanagement by EAA led to this problem. Instead of making the vendor the scapegoat for our organizations' incompetence, let there be a specific plan formulated, with a transparent schedule and objective along with an annual deduction in membership cost since we don't have one (a flight planner) for 2012. It is not a small problem, AOPA took about 10 years to finally incorporate a decent planner into their Website. Simply recommending some vague list of potentially fee-based substitutes is not an acceptable out.

flyingriki is correct that Aeroplanner was not much. Our plan should be not to avoid the problem but to provide a better product. Sorry about the rant flyingriki, but some times things have to be said. At least some of the EAA membership is presumably interested in flying.

[Janet Davidson]

Edgefly,

Pretty harsh judgement considering it is highly unlikely that you have all the facts to hand.

Charlie's list is certainly not vague. It includes some very popular, oft-used, and free flight planning services. We have been using fltplan.com for about 3 or 4 years now, both for work & when flying for fun, and find it to be an excellent service. The only thing I pay for on there is the eAPIS. With 4 flights to Canada in the last 3 weeks, I would be struggling without fltplan's eAPIS service.

Why not just use one of the services already out there, free, and proven?

And leave EAA to concentrate on other programs that they already do extremely well - YE, webinars, Hints for Homebuilders, etc, etc.

[S3flyer]

Well said Janet! I'd say that AeroPlanner was around 10th on the list of 6 free planners above....I'd rather EAA and AOPA focus on our core needs than spend resources on a "me too" planner.

[Mike M]

well, i for one was pretty disappointed when i learned we were losing aeroplanner. now i find out it was junk? maybe this is for the best. pretty surprised, too. i work ems, and every shift change i'd fire up aeroplanner, start a plan, and when the tones went off i'd plug the destination and the receiving into the blanks and hit 'enter'. worked fine, and i was usually less than two gallons off the estimate when i checked the fuel receipt later. not bad when you're burning 70 gph! so if they were lousy, who's best, folks? opinions, not facts, will be fine.

[steve]

As an active pilot, I don't think I'm alone in bidding Aeroplanner adieu and RIP. It truly was a dated and sloooow flight planning tool. Airnav and RunwayFinder are fine online tools. Additionally, the planning tool in my GPS has served me well for the last 3 years.

My $.02

[Frank Giger]

I'm such a luddite; still using a sectional, a protractor, scratch paper and a pencil!

[Mike M]

As an active pilot, I don't think I'm alone in bidding Aeroplanner adieu and RIP. It truly was a dated and sloooow flight planning tool. Airnav and RunwayFinder are fine online tools. Additionally, the planning tool in my GPS has served me well for the last 3 years. My $.02

i've used airnav for years, checked out runwayfinder.com.

here's an example of what i used aeroplanner for. night shift. takeoff from FL30, fly to 2FD3, pickup 600 lbs, fly to FA76, drop 30 lbs, fly to KOPF, refuel, return to 2FD3, drop 570 lbs, then to FL30. how much fuel do i need, can i pick up the fuel and the weight at 2FD3, can i make it from 2FD3 to FA76 unrefueled, will there be enough fuel left at FA76 to reach KOPF with legal reserve fuel, how much must i load at KOPF, can i carry enough to get all the way to FL30 or must i refuel after 2FD3? launch within five minutes of getting the call. GO!

airnav doesn't work well for that, and i can't fig'r out how to do it on runwayfinder.

and Frank said protractor etc. my backup is a string we hung on the wall map with a knot every ten gallons. not very precise.

[Dan]

I really like navmonster. It gives you weather info And everything else you may want all on one site. Check it out at navmonster.com

Doesn't exist anymore...

[Dan]

Edgefly,


Why not just use one of the services already out there, free, and proven?

And leave EAA to concentrate on other programs that they already do extremely well - YE, webinars, Hints for Homebuilders, etc, etc.

I don't agree here. I think the EAA should partner with a proven service to give the membership more value. Flight planning adds great value to the membership. The flight planning tool at AOPA was one of the reasons I used to have that membership but I dropped the membership when they failed to support my point of view so of course I lost access to the planner at the same time. The EAA flight planner worked well enough and was available from any computer I logged in from, but now of course that is no longer available.

Many of those 'free' planners are just that. You get what you pay for. Many of them seem shakey at best (the DUAT and DUATS services at least provide real briefings and do seem to work OK, but are not available unless you install them on the local computer or pay fees).

Like you say, the EAA has a proven track record of making great programs. Flight planning should be another tool that they support.

[MEdwards]

the DUAT and DUATS services at least provide real briefings and do seem to work OK, but are not available unless you install them on the local computer or pay fees.If you have a medical certificate (there are some special rules for SP I'm not familiar with), both DUAT.com and DUATS.com are available free and without installing any special software on the local computer. Just log on over the web. Perhaps they have added services or a spiffier interface if you install their own access software, but I've never used it. The basic service for each of them has improved slowly but steadily over the years, includes flight planning and TFRs, is very useful, and it's free. I prefer DUATS.com, but either is fine.

That said, I use the flight planner on AOPA.com for quick flight plans, to check routing and distances. I would like to see EAA offer something like that as a member benefit.

[Joe LaMantia]

I have been a "luddite" for many years, but recently discovered AOPA'a planner and I like the fact that I can print single page "legs" that I can put together into a little trip book....much easier than unfolding and refolding a sectional. Someday I'll pop for an iPad and go paperless!

Joe
:cool:

[Bill]

That said, I use the flight planner on AOPA.com for quick flight plans, to check routing and distances. I would like to see EAA offer something like that as a member benefit.

Probably the principal reason that I renew my AOPA membership each year is for continued use of their flight planner. If EAA offered a good flight planner as a member benefit, I could drop my AOPA membeship.

[flyingriki]

Probably the principal reason that I renew my AOPA membership each year is for continued use of their flight planner. If EAA offered a good flight planner as a member benefit, I could drop my AOPA membeship.

Here-here.....absolutely!

[FlyingRon]

I detest the AOPA planner. The only thing I can say positive about it is that it's better than the piece of crap one that was a hacked up version of FliteStar they were using before.
Actually, I purchased a full up subscription to aeroplanner after playing around with the EAA entry level. However, I'll probably let it lapse soon. Most flight planning I do in Foreflight these days. All I tend to use Aeroplanner for is when I'm away from the pad to look up charts.

[MEdwards]

All I tend to use Aeroplanner for is when I'm away from the pad to look up charts.And there are free tools for that, too, such as SkyVector.com.

[Hiperbiper]

So what...you folks actually PLAN your flights???

[stlskybob]

AGAIN I would like to protest EAA no longer supporting such a useful tool, NO WHERE else have I been able to find a flight planning program that you could print a trip tik like AeroPlanners, it was perfect for me, and I'm sure a lot of others used it as well. Individule replacement cost is ridiculous. Maybe if I cancel BOTH my EAA, and AOPA memberships I could put the cost towards Aeroplanner.

[Bill Greenwood]

I plan my trips here. I use the charts, both sec and wac, a yardstick and a plotter, and pen and paper, as well as a simple calculator.
It takes me about an hour or so.
I have never used some computer program, both because I am not much good on computers, but also the planning and drawing the course line on the charts, just like I learned it in basic flight school 30 years ago, gives me an idea of what is really out there; not just some numbers on a computer sheet, that don't relate to much if I have to divert for weather or otherwise.

[Mattmutz2]

Unfortunately, Aeroplanner has never shared the list of registered EAA users so we could not personally inform our members of the coming change.

That statement is entirely untrue. Back in my days on staff, I periodically received this data from Aeroplanner and compared it to the database of active members and worked with Aeroplanner to remove accounts whose EAA membership had lapsed.

[sgfreeman]

So, I'm the one who started this thread. After reading all the input, a few added words of my own. I used Aeroplanner for several years and must have had over 50 saved flight plans- some of them I put a lot of time into including flying cross country, creating waypoints to for a safe passage through the Rockies, etc. With the cancellation, all of that work was lost (I did print hard copies, but that just means I have to re-enter all the data somewhere else. I had hours and hours invested in creating those flight plans which I have used more than one time.

I checked out all the free flight planners people reference one by one. I didn't find one that I felt did the same as Aeroplanner without buying the upgrade version. So, I joined AOPA and have started using their flight planner. I like the EAA and what type of flying it stands for, but will most likely drop my memebership instead of paying for two.

As for the people that don't like computer based flight planners- don't be so quick to judge. That is like saying that steam gauges are much better than EFIS and EIS units. You may be more used to and comfortable flying with steam gauges or planning manually, but that has nothing to do with whether it is better or not. Most who say that have never really given the computer based systems a chance. I have flown with both now for several years and I would not ever want to give the valuable information provided by the computer based systems. They do everything you can manually plus many other valuable features. Quickly looking at the affect of different flight levels for winds aloft, automatic notams along your flight path, weather, replacing or adding waypoints with a click of a button, etc. , etc., etc.

So, I am over losing Aeroplanner. I miss some of the features, like the format you could print out your flight plan in. But, I am used to using the AOPA tool now and doing just fine. I just still have to enter all those flight plans in manually.