My Airline Experience

[Floatsflyer]

... you just have to be willing to pay for a first-class ticket. It's surprisingly cheap, at times.

Ron Wanttaja

I'm willing, tell me when, where, and who it's "surprisingly cheap", even comparatively to economy.

[Floatsflyer]

People whine about United now, but if the airline were to drop their airfares by ~$25 or so their planes would be full again.

Ron Wanttaja

Maybe after some good amount of time had passed with the "United Breaks Guitars" incident that captured the world's attention in 2009 but not this latest horrific event. Why? Because millions of law abiding, innocent, non-security risk passengers rightfully sitting aboard an airplane with a purchased ticket know that this heinous and violent corporate malfeasance could have happened to them. A pox on United. May they be sued out of existence and go the way of Eastern, Braniff, Pan Am, Air Florida, Frontier, National, Trump, and so many more. Do not f**k with your paying customers. Do not physically harm them-that's insane!

[rwanttaja]

I'm willing, tell me when, where, and who it's "surprisingly cheap", even comparatively to economy.

The question is, have you even bothered to check? Or do you just select "Coach"?

$30 extra, for one leg of a trip I'm taking soon. Overall on the entire trip, it was ~$300 more.

Ron Wanttaja

[Floatsflyer]

The question is, have you even bothered to check? Or do you just select "Coach"?

$30 extra, for one leg of a trip I'm taking soon. Overall on the entire trip, it was ~$300 more.

Ron Wanttaja

No, I don't check any longer because the difference can be from about $1000 to the multi-thousands subject to distance/destination from Toronto. Your deal sounds extraordinary especially if it's a long distance flight. However, if it's only Seattle to Portland or some other short haul, I wouldn't pay the extra $300.

[Frank Giger]

For a really long flight (more than a couple hours), I check the Business or First Class ticket prices.

Depending on when one is getting on the flying tube, it can be a nearly nominal fee compared to what could be a very long flight back in coach.

And I gave up on the discount airlines a long time ago. Not because of the airlines themselves, but the people one is forced to deal with while trapped aboard.

[rwanttaja]

No, I don't check any longer because the difference can be from about $1000 to the multi-thousands subject to distance/destination from Toronto. Your deal sounds extraordinary especially if it's a long distance flight. However, if it's only Seattle to Portland or some other short haul, I wouldn't pay the extra $300.

The $30 extra was just a short jaunt, a bit over an hour, but it was part of a whole round trip of ~3500 miles and the total first class airfare was about $350. Taking a trip this week, 2800 miles, where the first class was about $400 more (counting both legs). Different airline, but the first-class airfare includes access to their VIP lounges and those are nice (free munchies and soda, comfortable armchairs, free wifi, etc.).

But we've got only two data points established. Let's do a thought experiment and see what the cost of a more-comfortable flight would be without delving into first-class.

Let's imagine we've got a single-class airliner. Cattlecar Airlines puts six seats across, with 35 rows, with a 29" seat pitch (economy spacing). That's 210 people. If they all pay $200 for a ticket, that's $42,000. Half of them have checked bags, with a $25 fee, for an additional $2625. The airline receives $44,625.

Now comes our aggressive young start-up, Floatsair. They're going to give you SIX inches additional legroom. In addition, they're going to five-across seating, which makes each seat roughly 3-4" wider. The same type of airplane, so they'll fit less than three-quarters of the passengers carried by Cattlecar. They're also going to waive the checked-baggage fee. Having more than 50 people fewer in the cabin frees up a lot of overhead storage space, and speeds up boarding and unboarding.

So... what airfare do they have to charge to have the same income? About 50% more than Catttlecar Airlines: $307 vs. $200. There'll be some savings for Floatsair, since they probably don't need as large of a cabin crew. But the airfare will still be significantly higher.

And, of course, 99% of the potential customers sort their searches by price. They'll pick Cattlecar Airlines every time, and pat themselves on the back for being a smart shopper.

There have been several startups promising the same improved experience as Floatsair. All have tanked, because their airfare is higher. People want the comfort and service of air travel in the 70s, but aren't willing to pay the (adjusted) cost. Which is why I tend to roll my eyes when people complain about how awful air travel is today....

Ron Wanttaja

[DaleB]

Two flights on United today. Both completely full; both with little enough legroom even my wife was in pain after a 2 hour flight. It's a flying sardine can.

On the bright side, she did realize part way through that the RV-12 is more comfortable, the service is better and she could pack a full size bottle of shampoo. Considering that last weekend we also drove 9 hours when we could have flown less than 4 (were it not for nasty weather the whole trip) I think she may be coming around.

And Ron... my employer won't pay for first class, and every time I have been tempted they've wanted 2-3x the cost of the ticket for per leg. If you can find good deals on first class more power to you, but that has never been my experience. Not even once.

[rwanttaja]

...And Ron... my employer won't pay for first class, and every time I have been tempted they've wanted 2-3x the cost of the ticket for per leg. If you can find good deals on first class more power to you, but that has never been my experience. Not even once.

My former employer was the same way. Had to be the lowest cost, even if it was a one-stop that took hours longer than the non-stop. Could get an executive-level manager to sign off on it, though, so usually could get the non-stops.

It's ironic that airlines have "business class" that many employers don't allow their people to take advantage of.

I used to think that First Class was ridiculously expensive, but my wife (who has become addicted to it) has gotten better and better at finding the deals. We're taking a trip soon, and she saved $400 on the original first-class fare by coming home on a Wednesday instead of a Tuesday.

Just for S&Gs, I queried Delta regarding a potential round trip from Seattle to Minneapolis in June. For one flight, the first-class fare was almost $1000 higher than coach. But one leaving just 2 hours later, the price difference was just $215.

Ron Wanttaja

[Floatsflyer]

Now comes our aggressive young start-up, Floatsair. They're going to give you SIX inches additional legroom. In addition, they're going to five-across seating, which makes each seat roughly 3-4" wider. The same type of airplane, so they'll fit less than three-quarters of the passengers carried by Cattlecar. They're also going to waive the checked-baggage fee. Having more than 50 people fewer in the cabin frees up a lot of overhead storage space, and speeds up boarding and unboarding.Ron Wanttaja

Thanks, great name, very catchy. But you forgot to mention the largest cost savings. As it's an all seaplane and amphibious fleet airline this translates into much lower ticket prices because traditional airports and the fees their authorities charge are not required. Think bases similar to the ones used by the Pan Am China Clippers in the Pacific and Carribean.

[Bill Greenwood]

The extra cost of first class may be worth if for long trips like overseas or if you are tall etc. of just wealthy enough that cost is not a factor. But for shorter triops, lets say first class is $500 more, that would buy you anohter night at a hotel in Hawaii or anoghter ski day for family or 3 four star dinners., or another 45 min dual in a T6