Gripes

[Zack Baughman]

Surprised no one has mentioned charging $18/day for passes for EAA Member's kids 6 and up. My Dad started taking me in the early 80s and I have only missed one AirVenture since then. There were years my brother and I each brought 2 friends and my Dad paid for everyone's addmission, but I doubt he would have at 18 bucks a pop. Take a look at other major airshows and nobody charges that much for kids.
Reno comes close $17/day for the Races on Saturday and Sunday, but only $5 for the days earlier in the week.
Wings over Houston $4,
CAF AirSho $5
Planes Of Fame Airshow $5
Dayton Airshow $15 at the gate $12 in advance.
For an Organization that prides itself on getting kids into aviation to charge that to get kids into AirVenture seems a bit outragous...
It will not keep me from bringing my kids and their friends, but it may limit how many days we all go to the show and how much we spend on food and other items on the field.
Bryan Darnell
EAA # 80374

Having two young boys of my own, ages 11 and 8, I'd like to address this. That $18 gives kids admission to the EAA AirVenture Museum, all the activities at the KidVenture tent (where numerous items can be made and taken home, such as a wing rib or small carved wooden propeller at no extra charge, an opportunity to fly r/c and control line airplanes, etc), all the workshop forums (welding, fabric stitching, etc), the air show, all the evening entertainment (concerts, movies, etc), and everything else. Granted, many air shows do not charge as much as EAA does, but then again, most air shows do not include in the admission price access to a world-class convention and all the activities that it encompasses. I know a lot of air shows include kids' areas now with inflatable bouncy houses and such, but at every other show I've taken my boys to that have had those types of activities, I've always had to pay extra for "ride" tickets for my boys. Here at Oshkosh, all of that is included in your AirVenture admission.

It costs me ALOT more to take my boys to a movie in the local theater than it does to take them to AirVenture for a day.

Zack

[gbrasch]

This was my 24th Oshkosh, and certainly the tide has turned back this year. Improvements were evident all over the place.




The Bad:
1) Where did the "Protect-Our-Planes" volunteers go? I saw lots of baffoonery around people's aircraft. Is it going to take an accident caused by crowd induced damage before more is done? I will never park an airplane of mine east of Wittman road unless is well south of the center.


PS your all welcome for the good weather. Murphy guaranteed it when our groups wife's booked a house for the week after camping for 20+ years!

Ben, I did a little volunteer work for them last year. Then a few months ago I got a letter from EAA that they were "reassigned" and asked if I was interested. I just stuck with my regular volunteer job this year. Glenn

[Bill Greenwood]

As for as lack of "protect our plane" volunteers, and "baffoonery" (think is should be spelled buffoon) around people's planes that he writes that he saw, I didn't see the problem. Nor did I see any other year.

I have been coming to EAA for 31 years and have never seen or even heard of a plane being damaged by the crowd there. Many of these years I have brought a show plane, sometimes two and never had damage to them from the crowd.

In 25 years of displaying planes at airshows, I have only had damage twice. Once at Oshkosh, a re enactor (?)was having his photo taken in the cockpit and he was a big guy. When he climbed out he accidentally stepped on and bent a cover for the trim tab that is on the left side of the cockpit. I didn't find it until I was making my next landing, and it was a momentary problem , but once safely parked I easily bent it back into place to free up the trim.
Once many years ago, I think in Omaha or somewhere in the middle of the country, I had a small hole poked through the fabric of the elevator. I didn't see it done, but was told that someone saw a kid do it with a pencil. Of course one can be angry about that, but it was easy to patch with a little duct tape, and later with a fabric patch, and never affected the safety or airworthiness of the plane.
That is all the damage that I ever got.

I have also never heard any of the pilots or owners at show briefings complain or even bring this up as a problem. Maybe in some other group like antiques it might be, but I haven't seen it.
For perhaps the last 5 years I have brought a Bonanza rather than a show plane and parked it in N. 40, where there are no "protect our planes" people and never had it damaged.
I have also parked at Fon du Lac at least part of the convention most of the last 3 decades and never had any damage done.
Maybe he knows of something that I don't, but otherwise it seems to me to be worrying about a problem that really doesn't exist. I do use a "please look, but don't touch "sign on the prop.
I have seen a lot of comment by others on this and other sites about how owners don't want people near their planes, just as some pilots give reasons not to do Young
Eagle rides, but that is not the way it has been for me. But then again, I like people, certainly when they are in a good mood like at EAA.

I have had lot's of fingerprints or noseprints on the canopy by folks looking in, but that is not damage and cleans off easily.

[I_FLY_LOW]

~snip~ Many of these years I have brought a show plane, sometimes two and never had damage to them from the crowd.

In 25 years of displaying planes at airshows, I have only had damage twice. Once at Oshkosh, a re enactor (?)was having his photo taken in the cockpit and he was a big guy. When he climbed out he accidentally stepped on and bent a cover for the trim tab that is on the left side of the cockpit. I didn't find it until I was making my next landing, and it was a momentary problem , but once safely parked I easily bent it back into place to free up the trim.
Once many years ago, I think in Omaha or somewhere in the middle of the country, I had a small hole poked through the fabric of the elevator. I didn't see it done, but was told that someone saw a kid do it with a pencil. Of course one can be angry about that, but it was easy to patch with a little duct tape, and later with a fabric patch, and never affected the safety or airworthiness of the plane.
That is all the damage that I ever got.

HUH???

[keen9]

Bill, the line you are attributing to Glenn is a quote from my earlier post. I have seen all kinds of buffoonery at OSH. Granted it usually doesn't cause damage, but airplanes are not tanks. In past years OSH has been very good as far as care of aircraft goes. This year, I saw no "protect-our-planes" volunteers, and I saw people climbing on airplanes, smoking next to airplanes, using a stab as a kitchen table . . .

Anywhere east of Wittman road and north of about the ultra-light barn is no where that I want my plane parked. Obviously in the N-40 and Fond Du Loc where the crown consist mainly of pilots and their guests is fine, but in among the masses is scary to me.

Sure OSH has been better than other flyins, but I'd like it to stay that way, and the trend at OSH has not been favorable to that.

[Bill Greenwood]

Keen9, I corrected the "Glenn" part. Thanks
If you only want to park south of the ultralight barn and west of Wittman road, then you exclude 90% of all the plane parking at EAA.
And I think you misread my post. When I brought show planes in previous years, I certainly parked them in show parking at warbirds or Aeroshell plaza. I didn't just park at the north 40 or at FLD. And I think the "protect our plane" thing is a relatively new concept in the last 10 years or so, and was not there when I began in 1983. Still no damage back then.

If people are smoking right around planes, then that is a problem and could be a disaster in a year when we had dry grass, but I haven't seen it, at least not on the part where I am which is mostly the north 2/3 of the field. Yes, I have sometimes seen people climb onto a plane, but rarely and after all, they are probably not the only one or first one ever up there. What if you own a T6, do you think no one has ever been on the wing? Even if not as polite as it could be, it is rare and I have not seen damage from it. I have also seen people move control surfaces when they shouldn't and that is not polite, but again they are not the first to have done it and no damage resulted.

As for someone using the stabilizer as a picnic table, I'd guess is was their own plane, and would have a hard time believing a stranger just walked up to a plane at random and spread out their food.
If you saw all these things, did you get any photos? If so, why not post them here as an example of what not to do?

P S if you were new to Osh and didn't know better, you might think someone with a hat that looked like a block of cheese was a buffoon, but not in Wisconsin.

[rleffler]

One trend that I know several folks in the RV-10 parking area have experienced, is that some folks think an open hole on the a/c is a place to deposit trash. Fortunately, in the cases I'm aware, the pilot found the trash during preflight.

p.s. Bill, where I'm from we think all Cheeseheads, Badgers, and Wolverines are buffoons! At least until the Rose Bowl is over.......

[GeorgeP]

My mate and I travelled from Australia to attend our first Oshkosh Airshow this year and we thoroughly enjoyed ourselves. Great airshow, interesting people, and benign weather for the entire week - perfect! Before I go on, I must thank all the forum members who provided me with information during my pre-convention planning and preparation.
Right, now for the gripe. We are both pilots and keen photographers who prefer not to have too many people in the background or frame of our aircraft photos. I acknowledge that an airshow environment is not the ideal forum at which to aim for this result but we persist. When we fly 12,000 miles to attend an airshow, we put in alot of work to get a shot we're happy with. Our biggest problem is people walking between the camera and the subject whilst we are photographing. We jokingly refer to this type of person as a "pest". The worst type of pests are those who linger around the aircraft, inspecting every fastener and lap joint, oblivious to the fact that someone is attempting to photograph the aircraft.

My most memorable encounter with such 'pests' (it still makes me smile) ocurred on the last day when I was photographing a T6 over in the Warbird area. Picture this.... I was about four metres from the wingtip, about to press the shutter when an ex-military vehicle, complete with large calibre machine gun, stops between me and the aircraft. What the...... ? I cleared my throat a couple of times but they either didn't hear me or chose to ignore me. I patiently waited, hoping they'd soon move on, but they decided to call for reinforcements and motioned to one of their friends who promply arrived on a Vespa! All three closely inspected the T6 for about 5 minutes before moving on. I decided to photograph the situation and now share it with you. The faces and licence plates have been blurred to protect the guilty. Many thanks to the organisers, volunteers, and participants for putting on such a great event. I hope to return in a couple of years.



Let's check out the T6.


Re-inforcements arrive.



Patience is rewarded.

[mazdaP5]

Looks good! I've got the same problem, but I always consider that at some point, I'm someone else's pest, and patience is always rewarded. I also try to take photos where there are no portapottys in shot, but that doesn't always work out either.

[MEdwards]

That's pretty flagrant. But for every case of someone walking into my photo there were two or three cases where somebody stopped or ducked, often unnecessarily, so as to avoid my field of view. Often I'd wave them on with a smile and a thank you.