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Thread: Where Have All the EAB Aircraft Gone?

  1. #101
    Airmutt's Avatar
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    Yup, 125 years ago inventors and manufacturers were not burdened with the mountains of regs and requirements that exist today. For example, I worked a program where DCMA rep prohibited soldering strain gage leads as he considered it a fire hazard in a hangar that was equipped with a deluge system. The acquisition cost for laying in the gages subsequently increased by about eight fold. And that’s just one small example.
    Bet Uncle Einar wasn’t told that he had to do an emissions environmental impact study either.
    Dave Shaw
    EAA 67180 Lifetime
    Learn to Build, Build to Fly, Fly for Fun

  2. #102
    Kind of strayed a bit off topic here don't you think??

  3. #103
    Airmutt's Avatar
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    Oh we took a left turn onto the dirt road along time ago.
    Dave Shaw
    EAA 67180 Lifetime
    Learn to Build, Build to Fly, Fly for Fun

  4. #104
    DaleB's Avatar
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    Probably no charging stations on it either.
    Measure twice, cut once...
    scratch head, shrug, shim to fit.

    Flying an RV-12. Building a Fisher Celebrity.

  5. #105
    robert l's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Airmutt View Post
    Yup, 125 years ago inventors and manufacturers were not burdened with the mountains of regs and requirements that exist today. For example, I worked a program where DCMA rep prohibited soldering strain gage leads as he considered it a fire hazard in a hangar that was equipped with a deluge system. The acquisition cost for laying in the gages subsequently increased by about eight fold. And that’s just one small example.
    Bet Uncle Einar wasn’t told that he had to do an emissions environmental impact study either.
    I hate to keep this going but I'm going to anyway. Just 20 years ago you were expected to go into a confined space and weld stainless steel or torch off the coal ash collector plates, which contained arsenic, all without a respirator. The excuse was, we didn't know, but now days, you better have all your poop in one sock ! It's a plus for the guys working in the field, but at the same time, add a lot of extra time to get the job done or the project completed. Be safe, be smart, live long and prosper.
    I'm going to do it too.
    Bob (I don't know why I said that last part) Crawford

  6. #106

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    The first practical electric car was almost exactly 125 years ago.
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hist...ectric_vehicle

  7. #107

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    Quote Originally Posted by Airmutt View Post
    Yup, 125 years ago inventors and manufacturers were not burdened with the mountains of regs and requirements that exist today.
    Although I see your point, I also have to take a minor exception to it. We have the EAB category where we can do just about anything we want. Plus, Orville and Wilbur didn't build the first Flyer for production. In addition it is our labor costs that have skyrocketed (people costs). DER's are $200/hour and Engineers are $60-$100/hour and their whole goal is to extend the program as long as possible. Yes, it's very expensive to certify an airplane. BUT, I also think that we (as OEM's) do A LOT more than the FAA requires. Nothing says we can't certify the way we did back in the 40s.

    The new ASTM standards will reduce costs too. We are working very hard on that end of the equation.

    Blue on Top,
    Ron

    PS. Good friend has a Tesla. Puts 25,000 miles/year on it Ö including the annual trip to Oshkosh (from Wichita, KS). The car tells him where the charging stations are and how long he will have to wait to be charged Ö little more than the time to take a restroom/food break.

  8. #108

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Blum View Post
    Nothing says we can't certify the way we did back in the 40s.
    I thought it was the job/intent/reality of Part 23 that certification is much more involved today?

  9. #109

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyle Boatright View Post
    I thought it was the job/intent/reality of Part 23 that certification is much more involved today?
    The intent of the ďnewĒ part 23 (now almost 2 years old) is to make certification easier. We (as OEMs) need to fight back on doing anything more than the regulations specifically call out. Good airplanes were certified using cockpit data. With todayís panel and GPS data, that is more than we had before, AND itís in a form that is easily manipulated by programs like Excel.

    I meant to say this earlier, but the FAA will not give one a proposed way that they may do something in the future. You must apply and force a decision/resolution. The FAA is currently begging for people to do this. They canít think of everything anyone could come up with (to make the regulations totally complete). Just do it!

  10. #110

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    Why would any sane business person get involved at all with a certification process that requires arbitrary permission?
    The internet doesn't require permission to start a business so it works. I read a book about Internet business titled "Without their Permission" https://www.amazon.com/s?k=without+t...b_sb_ss_i_1_13

    I have watched these attempts to save private aviation from over regulation for 50 years.
    Nothing works.
    Last edited by Bill Berson; 09-06-2019 at 09:27 AM.

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