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Thread: Where Have All the EAB Aircraft Gone?

  1. #41
    robert l's Avatar
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    So much good information here and so many reasons for this or that, so I'll just put in my 2 cents worth. "Hell, I just want to fly"
    Bob

  2. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by robert l View Post
    "Hell, I just want to fly"
    Bob
    Agree. Thumbs up!

  3. #43
    rwanttaja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Blum View Post
    Flight paths of autonomous aircraft (UBER goal) will typically not cross with J-3s up through airlines as they will be intercity, roof top to roof top and very low altitude. I'm also not sure that whole aircraft recovery parachutes (BRS is a brand name) is a factor either. The vehicles (proposed to date) are powered lift and will have to proceed through "graceful degradation". Ironically, failure modes of powered lift typically result in a tumbling vehicle … an area where parachutes have limited success.
    I kind of think we'll see a mix of autonomous air vehicles. Small, short-range Blackfly types, but I think we'll also find, essentially, autonomized Cirrus-class vehicles. On those you might see the rocket parachute systems, but I agree, the rotor-based devices may get something based on planned graceful degradation.

    "Whole Aircraft Recovery Parachute"=WARP. Kinda like that, but since the "w" is silent in "whole," let's use an "H" instead=HARP. Seems more fitting... "Had a structural failure, so I grabbed my HARP...." :-)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Blum View Post
    On the original topic, I think that there are less and less plans availability. There are more and more assembly kits available. There are many more one-off designs, though, of younger people experimenting on their own (and coming up from the RC world). BTW, I loved the flying car racing forum. It is people like this that will cause the next breakthroughs. We old guys call them crazy, but people that build their own airplanes have been called that since the early 50s. Oh heck, before even Orville and Wilbur.
    I think much of the young (and even older) hobbyists are getting away from the assembly mode. When I go to the hobby store, I see a few kits but mostly Almost Ready to Fly (ARF) products. And if you want a nice plastic scale model of a P-51 or something, you actually buy a pre-painted 1/72 scale model and snap the wings on.

    I heard the original Heathkit sold out when they did a market survey and discovers that, every year, the average age of their customers went up about a year....In other words, no younger people starting.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Blum View Post
    ...great article on E-AB fatal accidents in Kitplanes this month. Although it is only 4 pages long, I know the amount of time and effort behind all that research and getting the data into nice, readable charts/graphs. Thank You!!!
    You're welcome, it's good to know someone actually READS them. Gets pretty grim sometimes, spending six hours on the computer tabulating death and destruction in the homebuilt world. Makes me want to show up on the EAA forums and look like an idjit, sometimes....

    Ron "Mission Accomplished" Wanttaja

  4. #44
    rwanttaja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by robert l View Post
    So much good information here and so many reasons for this or that, so I'll just put in my 2 cents worth. "Hell, I just want to fly"
    Bob
    Gill Robb Wilson poem I posted a couple of years back....kind of sums it up.

    http://eaaforums.org/showthread.php?...ll-Robb-Wilson

    Ron Wanttaja

  5. #45

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    In the late 60's, I was just out of high school and starting college. I would sit in the parking lot at Phillip Billard airport in Topeka, Ks. I had a cheap Radio Shack radio and would listen to tower and watch airplanes land and taxi up to the restaurant. It was like a mini Oshkosh. The ramp in front of the restaurant would be full by 11:30 and other traffic would have to park way on up the ramp - sans tie downs. It was great! I didn't have a pilots license. But, what I did have was a dream and my other friends still in bed from last nights party.

    Today, you drive past that same restaurant at lunch time on any weekend and you might see one or two aircraft. The restaurant inside is still full, but, it's mostly pilots who now resort to driving in instead of flying in. It's very sad. I don't know if GA will ever come back. I hope so. My old man thinking is:
    Today, it's easy to get a college degree. Just go sit in front of a pc and get your degree.
    Want to fly? Sit in front of your pc.
    Want to socialize? Sit in front of your pc.
    Today's world is full of instant gratification.
    "Back in My Day", if you wanted to entertain yourself, you got on you bike, rode around town and got a bunch of guys together to meet at the school yard for baseball. Today, you just look down at your phone and click on an app and play Madden Football.
    "Back in My Day", if you wanted to fly, you begged, borrowed or stole a bunch of money, took flying lessons and a dreaded check ride. Today, you just click on XPlane. It's so easy and so instantly gratifying.

    There will always be an Oshkosh. There will always be lots of airplanes in attendance. There will also be, a bizillion overweight, shabbily dressed, diabetic infested segment of society, sitting in front of their pc with three monitors, playing solitaire. Much like I am doing now.

  6. #46
    Airmutt's Avatar
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    There is no doubt that societal, political, financial, and technological changes have influenced how we view aviation. I a
    was a young teenager before I ever boarded an airliner. As kids we would bike to play on the AD Skyraider gate guard that the Navy left when it abandoned the old Atlanta Naval Air Station. At 15 I begged my parents to let me take that ever so expensive Cessna introduction flight at $20 for my birthday.
    I was hooked. I was fascinated by the pure act of flying. That single flight set the course for the rest of my life. It was pure luck that someone had left a copy of SA at the flight school. One of the things that drew me to EAA was Paul P’s passion for aviation and those really cool airplanes called homebuilts.
    As time passes the attendance numbers of various types inevitably dwindle. Building takes major commitment, that commitment is not lost on me even if the plane changes hands over time. Wouldn’t be nice if the current owners honored that commitment and shared their planes with us for just one week.
    Dave Shaw
    EAA 67180 Lifetime
    Learn to Build, Build to Fly, Fly for Fun

  7. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by rwanttaja View Post
    The operators will not have to learn the arcane skills necessary for control of elevator, aileron, rudder, and throttle to reach a destination.
    Arcane? I think that's the easy part.

  8. #48
    rwanttaja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rwanttaja View Post
    The operators will not have to learn the arcane skills necessary for control of elevator, aileron, rudder, and throttle to reach a destination. The vehicle will do it all.
    Quote Originally Posted by dougbush View Post
    Arcane? I think that's the easy part.
    My dear sir, if it's so easy, why is failure in these skills the leading cause of aircraft accidents?

    The irony is, that if you were to poll the folks who have chimed in on how much they like to fly, they'd all agree that the fun is in exercising those same arcane skills. None of us daydream in meetings thinking about programming our GPSs, none of us watch the evening news blank-eyed, considering the challenges of fuel management, none of us geek out over the joys of ATC communication.

    Well... maybe Ron Natalie. :-)

    The physical control of a small aircraft is simple to learn, but takes a lifetime to master. My first flight in a Fly Baby was in 1986, and, except for BFRs and an 18-month dalliance with a Stinson, I've been flying one Fly Baby or another for the past 33 years. Why am I not bored to tears by it?

    BECAUSE I STILL HAVEN'T FRICKIN' GOT IT RIGHT!

    And that's where the fun is...the challenge of the smooth takeoff, keeping a stable attitude, watching for traffic, and managing to land that hard-mouthed SOB smoothly regardless of the winds, regardless of the runway, regardless of the loading, regardless of my own physical state. One of my landings last Saturday was so bad I almost reached back to manually trigger the ELT. And of COURSE it was in front of a crowd at a fly-in.

    But you know...I'm having one heck of a good time.

    But you see, that's where the split lies, when we start talking about autonomous aircraft. Most of the participants here are pilots because it's fun. But the majority of the world treats aviation like I do cars: The vehicle's job is to haul my rear end to places I want to go.

    General Aviation is hurting; I'm hoping the rise in autonomous air vehicles will bring a flood of new people into aviation, even if their interest is in mere transportation.

    Ron Wanttaja

  9. #49

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    Quote Originally Posted by rwanttaja View Post
    But you see, that's where the split lies, when we start talking about autonomous aircraft. Most of the participants here are pilots because it's fun. But the majority of the world treats aviation like I do cars: The vehicle's job is to haul my rear end to places I want to go.

    General Aviation is hurting; I'm hoping the rise in autonomous air vehicles will bring a flood of new people into aviation, even if their interest is in mere transportation.

    Ron Wanttaja

    I think (and hope) that both will exist for many, many years to come. Although I utilize my automobile for transportation (mainly), I do enjoy looking at custom cars both in shows and driving down the road.

    As for the earlier statement about baby versus semi, this is why I think everyday, true, full-autonomous flights will happen before automobiles. Aircraft don't have to deal with babies or tractor trailers Now if Tesla would just hurry up and get the lawsuit minutia out of the way, we could design some great airplanes.

    Ron "The world doesn't run on Dunkin" Blum

  10. #50
    FlyingRon's Avatar
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    and managing to land that hard-mouthed SOB smoothly

    They say that planes take after their owners


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