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Thread: Designated Smoking Areas

  1. #11

    Angry

    Quote Originally Posted by Kyle Boatright View Post
    The most dangerous part of Airventure is getting there. Driving or flying - both are dangerous. Second hand smoke in an outdoor setting? Negligible risk.

    Have you considered the skin cancer risks due to sun exposure?
    That's not the point, Kyle. It's about ignoring the rules. Without rules and following the rules you have chaos and people who put self above community. Don McLean's 'American Pie' pretty much sums up this new America.

    Next year's Oshkosh will only be 4 days for me rather than my usual 10. I'm reaching the point where I've had enough.

  2. #12

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    Some are just oblivious to the non-smoking policy. They are likely non-aviators and possibly first-timers at Oshkosh. For the Wednesday night airshow, the announcer comes over the speaker and gives the non-smoking announcement. Within 2 minutes a guy to our right, sitting in the massive crowd, under a Cessna wing (not his), lights up. At least 3 people erupted and and quickly reminded him of the rule. He had no idea and quickly put it out, apologized to everyone around him. Likely similar to the people who bring tents to the front of the flight line for the airshow. Most still get away with that...

  3. #13
    FlyingRon's Avatar
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    I'd buy your disingenuous explanation if you had limited yourself to smokers, but you decided to become the holier than thou arbitrator of vapers as well. It appeasr that no matter how safe-to-you and inobtrusive the act, the truth is you have an unjustified prejudice against those users.

  4. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ronald Franck View Post
    That's not the point, Kyle. It's about ignoring the rules. Without rules and following the rules you have chaos and people who put self above community. Don McLean's 'American Pie' pretty much sums up this new America.

    Next year's Oshkosh will only be 4 days for me rather than my usual 10. I'm reaching the point where I've had enough.
    I despise smoking. I'd greatly appreciate if the grounds were smoke free, but I can deal with the current rules and don't often see the rules broken. I don't want to see the rules broken. That said, EAA relies on peer pressure and gentle persuasion to corral the smokers. IMO, EAA doesn't have the resources to police this on a site as large as Oshkosh.

    But my implied point was I thought the other poster running down a list of chemicals in second hand smoke was a bit overdone. There are much bigger risks built into the Oshkosh experience and/or everyday life.
    Last edited by Kyle Boatright; 08-14-2019 at 07:40 PM.

  5. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ronald Franck View Post
    Without rules and following the rules you have chaos and people who put self above community. Don McLean's 'American Pie' pretty much sums up this new America.
    I think you have your songs confused. "American Pie" was about the day the music died, Feb. 2, 1959, Buddy Holly, the Big Bopper and Richie Valens in a plane crash.

    The song you are probably thinking about that references rules and breaking those rules in a satiric, humourous manner is "Alice's Restaurant" by Arlo Guthrie. It wasn't about smokin', it was about litterin'. "You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant, except Alice."

  6. #16
    FlyingRon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Floatsflyer View Post
    It wasn't about smokin', it was about litterin'.
    ...and creating a nuisance.

  7. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyle Boatright View Post
    I despise smoking. I'd greatly appreciate if the grounds were smoke free, but I can deal with the current rules and don't often see the rules broken. I don't want to see the rules broken. That said, EAA relies on peer pressure and gentle persuasion to corral the smokers. IMO, EAA doesn't have the resources to police this on a site as large as Oshkosh.

    But my implied point was I thought the other poster running down a list of chemicals in second hand smoke was a bit overdone. There are much bigger risks built into the Oshkosh experience and/or everyday life.
    Kyle- the reason I know the Chemicals in Cigarette Smoke is because exposure to Second Hand Smoke in a Public Outdoor Setting almost killed my 6 year old niece. So nope, not “A Bit Overdone”. In less than 3 minutes a little girl who loves airplanes, puppies, coloring and baby goats went from a perfectly healthy and normal little sweetheart to full cardiac arrest in her mother’s arms. Her lips turned ice blue. Her face was literally gun metal grey. Pretty much the scariest experience of my life. Since then I’ve become an expert on Second Hand Smoke and what it can do. I’m well versed in parts per million, downwind slip stream, chemical vapor composition and molecular structure. So don’t tell me about “much bigger risks”. Our job as pilots is to mitigate risk. We don’t pick and choose which risk. We do everything in our power to mitigate any risk we can think of. Period. Second Hand Smoke is a major risk. Plain and Simple. The Surgeon General of the United States says so. The American Heart Association says so. The American Lung Association says so. But most importantly, my 6 year old niece says so. And I’m going to take her word for it every time.

  8. #18

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    Read this Ron-

    https://www.cnn.com/2019/08/14/health/vaping-lung-disease-minnesota/index.html


    [QUOTE=FlyingRon;77482]I'd buy your disingenuous explanation if you had limited yourself to smokers, but you decided to become the holier than thou arbitrator of vapers as well. It appeasr that no matter how safe-to-you and inobtrusive the act, the truth is you have an unjustified prejudice against those users.[/QUOTE

  9. #19
    FlyingRon's Avatar
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    Yeah so? The issue isn't whether the activity is unhealthy for the person partaking in it, but whether it creates a health problem for those in the vicinity who aren't partaking in it.
    Frankly, I can't understand the hatred towards vapers. There's no indication that "second hand vaping" causes any problem and in fact, I've sat right next to vapers without realizing what they were doing until I caught them taking a hit from it. It would appear that there's no rational use for this other than that people hate the concept of smokers more than they fear any impact on their own health.

    I can't see vaping as big of a health hazard as breathing TEL fumes form 13.000 leaded-fuel burning aircraft.

  10. #20

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    Particulate matter found in Vape discharge is dangerous to anyone breathing it. I would highly recommend not breathing it. It’s 100 Percent a problem for those in the Vicinity. That’s what Johns Hopkins has to say on it from their research but honestly it doesn’t take research to just have common sense on it. Our bodies are designed to breath oxygen. Not nicotine. Not Formaldehyde. Not hydrogen Cynaide. None of that. Just oxygen. All of those chemicals have been found in Vape as well as Cigarettes. So yup. Vape isn’t safe from a Second Hand Smoke exposure prospective either.

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