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Thread: Trams. Oh, those Trams

  1. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by FlyingRon View Post
    Oh, and then what do we do with the aircraft?

    The bigger problem is the FAA (and I'm sure the insurers) have strict rules about who can be forward of the burn line and in what circumstance.
    I wouldn't move the trams to the taxiway until the opening day after the airport is full and aircraft are minimal.
    The trams would yield to aircraft, of course. And change direction as the runway in use changes. Trams frequently stop for crossing aircraft now. What's the problem?
    The lack of unauthorized persons is exactly the point Plenty of security scooters patrolling that area. Cars drive on the taxiway at my local federally funded airport by design (0s9). No other way for cars to access the hangers.
    But yes, I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for the FAA to get any creative or common sense ideas.
    Last edited by Bill Berson; 08-10-2019 at 07:54 PM.

  2. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by steve View Post
    I completed the tram survey last night. Some thoughts:
    1. My group arrived Friday the 19th. That day wasn't on their list of arrival day choices.
    2. Every question concerned Monday. They skipped the rest of the week.
    3. To steal a line from Caddyshack, "I ain't payin' 50 cents for no coke."
    My guess is the remote parking idea did not play well.

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by martymayes View Post
    I just did a survey on tram service which seemed to focus on whether or not a fee to ride trams could be justified.
    Is this survey still open and is it available to any interested party?

  4. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ronald Franck View Post
    Is this survey still open and is it available to any interested party?
    I got it via email

  5. #45
    FlyingRon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Berson View Post
    I wouldn't move the trams to the taxiway until the opening day after the airport is full and aircraft are minimal.
    There is no such time any time while the NOTAM is in effect.
    The trams would yield to aircraft, of course. And change direction as the runway in use changes. Trams frequently stop for crossing aircraft now. What's the problem?
    Yielding would mean getting off the taxiway entirely. While the tractor wouldn't have an issue, those trailers aren't the best off-road vehicles especially given the terrain leading up to the taxiway.
    The lack of unauthorized persons is exactly the point Plenty of security scooters patrolling that area. Cars drive on the taxiway at my local federally funded airport by design (0s9). No other way for cars to access the hangers.
    But yes, I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for the FAA to get any creative or common sense ideas.
    0S9 ain't a tower controlled airport with THE BUSIEST MOVEMENT AREA IN THE WORLD. There are no "security scooters" out there at all. Those are the flight line ops people moving aircraft (in fact, I had to have the REAL SECURITY guys in a the cars run off some "security yahoo" in a scooter I found in our area.

    You're not going to get a change to the agreement the airshow and the FAA operate under that those over the line must specifically approved, wearing appropriate safety vests, etc.

  6. #46

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Berson View Post
    Express trams could use the taxiway.
    How fast would you envision a John Deere tractor to go to become an express tram ? Tractors have the transmissions locked into low range and the best you can get is 7 mph ( We are not allowed to exceed that even if we could) When driving the "yellow route", with all the people you are constantly dodging, I am lucky to hit 2 mph. I get to take the Make A Wish kids on tour on last Saturday. Part of this is getting them to the VIP / Airshow center tent at end of the day. Even with the Border Patrol and Forest Service agents making way for me, I am crawling at best to get there and people still "have a problem" of moving out of the way.

  7. #47

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    I accept the tram service as doing the best it can with what it has to serve the most people it can each day. That is subject to the logistical realities of how many trams can be put into service, largely based on how many tram volunteers are available to work that shift, 2 workers per tram plus the finite size of the entire tram fleet allocated to general people moving (special use trams excluded). Once the entire fleet is in service - and yes that was the case often during AirVenture - then we were moving as many passenger-visitors as we could. MANY, MANY folks got to ride vs walking. MANY, MANY didn't. Welcome to Oshkosh, where the primary 'people movers' are comfy shoes. Always has been the case, always will be the case.
    "Don't believe everything you see or read on the internet" - Abraham Lincoln

  8. #48

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    Quote Originally Posted by CHICAGORANDY View Post
    I accept the tram service as doing the best it can with what it has to serve the most people it can each day. That is subject to the logistical realities of how many trams can be put into service, largely based on how many tram volunteers are available to work that shift, 2 workers per tram plus the finite size of the entire tram fleet allocated to general people moving (special use trams excluded). Once the entire fleet is in service - and yes that was the case often during AirVenture - then we were moving as many passenger-visitors as we could. MANY, MANY folks got to ride vs walking. MANY, MANY didn't. Welcome to Oshkosh, where the primary 'people movers' are comfy shoes. Always has been the case, always will be the case.
    Again, agree with you Randy, 100%!!

  9. #49
    Wrongway Feldman's Avatar
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    And You, could be a Pilot, of one of these Today! Click on video to hear audio.

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    Last edited by Wrongway Feldman; 08-13-2019 at 11:46 AM.

  10. #50

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    Quote Originally Posted by FlyingRon View Post
    There is no such time any time while the NOTAM is in effect.

    Yielding would mean getting off the taxiway entirely. While the tractor wouldn't have an issue, those trailers aren't the best off-road vehicles especially given the terrain leading up to the .....
    Maybe 8 feet of the taxiway could be sectioned off with cones for trams or buses. I couldn't find the exact taxiway width, but appears to be about 35 feet wide from measuring the sat view compared 150 feet wide main runway. Large airplanes are not common going to south 40. The tram drivers might need to be pilots with some ability to take instructions from the tower if needed.
    Waupun intersects the taxiway. There's a few hard surface turnouts along the taxiway (see sat view), a few more pads could be made if needed. Otherwise, aircraft can drive on the grass as needed.
    Last edited by Bill Berson; 08-13-2019 at 01:38 PM.

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