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Thread: the "Turn Back"

  1. #11
    The fact that people have an opinion about this topic WITHOUT asking:
    - how long is the runway
    - how long was the roll before rotate
    - how steep was the rate of climb
    - what is the airplane glide ratio

    ... seems nutty to me.

    Seriously. An airplane might takeoff and start to climb in the first 200 feet of a 5000 foot long runway. And maybe it is a motor-glider with a 20:1 or 30:1 or 50:1 glide ratio. And maybe this particular motor-glider has a 140HP 915iS engine that lets it climb at an astounding rate. So by the end of the runway the airplane could be thousands of feet in the air ... and yet still over the runway! Hell, the extreme case I'm describing the motor-glider might be able to glide around the pattern 3 times before reaching the ground.

    And on the other extreme a pilot might be flying a "flying brick" that barely gets off the ground by the end of the 5000 foot runway.

    And yet people think they can hold one simple "rule of thumb" and apply that to every case? Well, they can do that for themselves, but some of us are too thoughtful and "calculating" to adopt such massively over-simplistic context-free authoritarian dictates for ourselves.
    Last edited by max_reason; 05-23-2019 at 08:19 PM.

  2. #12
    Mayhemxpc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by George Sychrovsky View Post
    If you at fly Minimum sink airspeed and bank into 30 to 45 degrees turn you will definitely stall and enter a spin promptly.

    I don't know how you could fly like this and still be here to type replies.
    ...and yet here I am. Maybe it’s because (a) I know the planes I fly and what their envelopes are (b) Vx for the Warrior is 63 KIAS and stalling speed at 30 degrees bank is 52 KIAS, for the 182 Vx is 65 and stall at 30 degrees is 54, and (c) as I wrote, I am unloading the wings during the turn, which lowers the angle of attack and thereby the effective indicated stall speed.

    As you wrote earlier, “proper training is everything.”
    Chris Mayer
    N424AF
    www.o2cricket.com

  3. #13
    George Sychrovsky's Avatar
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    My numbers for 182 45 degrees bank shows stall at 70 knots

    happy landings
    Disclaimer ; opinions of others will vary depending on what they’re selling.

    http://the-grand-design.com/

  4. #14
    rwanttaja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by George Sychrovsky View Post
    My numbers for 182 45 degrees bank shows stall at 70 knots
    What does it stall at in that bank angle if you're not trying to maintain altitude? The wing stalls at a given angle of attack, not airspeed.

    Ron Wanttaja

  5. #15

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    In my little plane, if the engine quits on takeoff, chances are I still have 3/4 of a mile of runway ahead of me.
    The opinions and statements of this poster are largely based on facts and portray a possible version of the actual events.

  6. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by George Sychrovsky View Post
    If you at fly Minimum sink airspeed and bank into 30 to 45 degrees turn you will definitely stall and enter a spin promptly.
    Sorry - I couldn't let this one go. An airplane will only enter a spin from a skid position. Review the Private Pilot ACS - applicant is required to demonstrate a stall while in a turn. Of course a pilot can make a airplane stall and spin at any airspeed - but that's the pilot who makes that happen - not the airplane.

  7. #17
    thomaspanton's Avatar
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    That's great.

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