Non flying solo flight training via a Penguin

[cluttonfred]

The powered-wheel version might be a fun go kart but it will lose the ground training aspect without a prop wash to raise the tail or any "torque" to correct with the rudder. You'd end up with a grown-up version of a pedal plane.

[jedi]

The powered-wheel version might be a fun go kart but it will lose the ground training aspect without a prop wash to raise the tail or any "torque" to correct with the rudder. You'd end up with a grown-up version of a pedal plane.

True. But it is a Powered pedal plane. Much faster and more fun in addition to having the capability to make controlled jumps and three axis control. Glider pilots learn the required flying skills without propwash or engine torque. These are important issues but a well trained and experienced pilot will handle them the same as he would handle turbulence or any other upset issue.

Thank you all for your input but this is page two and I see little interest in the proposal. I do not intend to pursue it further. If, in the future there is an interest. I may be available to assist.

[CHICAGORANDY]

Hey, it was a fun idea and discussion anyway - personally I see more chance to get sued when a novice drops 5-10 feet in a 'non-airplane' and gets injured. And you just know that would happen.

[Bill Berson]

Maybe you could rig a standard trainer so the throttle gets killed back to idle (or off if electric) automatically the instant the wheels lift.

[rwanttaja]

Thanks Cluttonfred,

What I propose is to go electric with power to the wheel and eliminate the propeller. Add enough power and wing to allow short crow hops or at least to get light on the wheel. Max height is limited because as soon as one leaves the ground there is no more traction through the wheel.

Unfortunately, the effect is not binary (traction/no traction). As the plane increases in speed, weight will be coming off the wheels, and the powered wheels will have less and less traction and thus have trouble accelerating the trainer. One could play with aerodynamic effects to keep the plane planted on the ground until there's enough speed for liftoff, but then the pilot is not operating like they are actually trying to fly an aircraft.

I'd go with a pair of ducted fans using electric motors. That greatly reduces the "chopper" risk, and as you say, speed/altitude can be limited by the motor controller. It also easily supports a remote kill switch, should the instructor deem it necessary to shut the beast down.

Ron Wanttaja

[Bill Greenwood]

I read of one famous Lutfwaffe pilot who wrote o training in a plane that had such short wings that it would only hop,dont think it was a power thing.

p
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[Bill Berson]

I saw a penguin trainer in the Western Antique Airplane and Auto Museum (WAAAM) in Hood River OR.
I think any trainer might work if the throttle was limited properly.

[1600vw]

I thought the idea behind the penguin was no matter how fast you taxied the airplane would not fly. The wings were to short to produce the lift needed for flight.

[Bill Berson]

Well yeah. But how many penguin trainers have you seen around?

Some foam spoilers could be strapped on the trainers wings if needed.

[1600vw]

Well yeah. But how many penguin trainers have you seen around?

Some foam spoilers could be strapped on the trainers wings if needed.

A friend had a man call him and asked if my buddy would fly his newly built airplane. My buddy spend an evening trying to fly that airplane. It never did come off the ground no matter how fast he went down the runway. My buddy came to the conclusion the wings " main wings and tail feathers" were setup wrong. The airplane would not produce lift to fly. I told my buddy this airplane would make a good trainer to train new pilots tail wheel handling on the ground, for it will never fly no matter what you do.