What the fourum should b and could be

[Frank Giger]

This could be the problem....

Let's just assume we engaged in a huge back-and-forth about validity of one person's opinion over another's, engaging in oneupmanship, eventually invoked Godwin's law, and absolutely failed to reach agreement on anything other than we disagree with each other on this one matter. It will save us both time and words.

I have no desire to go through that nutroll - as pilots and builders we have so much in common that it would be a harmful exercise - a point that I very poorly tried to bring across.

Here's an example of how non-aviation stuff can ruin an otherwise beautiful aviation relationship:

My CFI was great. I say that because in style of teaching and his ability to gauge a student's actual progress really meshed with mine. In fact, he was my second CFI, as I fired my first one - a young man who was a good CFI but very quiet and reserved, speaking very rarely and completely unflappable. This also made him unreadable and I had no idea what I was doing right or wrong most of the time.

So I interviewed another, and grinned at the first bit of sarcasm. My CFI was quick to give feedback both good and bad, laid out specific goals and was very honest on how well I met them. His goal was to train me to my check ride, yes, but it was clear he wanted me to be a good pilot overall, to look at the whole of flying, and put things into context. We got along famously, very professionally, even though we used a bit of "vernacular" to pepper our conversations. I can't say we became friends; the only reason we spent time together is because I was handing over a handful of cash for the privilege. However, it was never a chore (at least not for me), and we gained respect for each other.

One day I was talking to one of my pilot friends and mentioned my CFI with a glowing review of his abilities to teach a knucklehead like me how to fly and I got a very sour look.

"He's an atheist and a screaming liberal," the man said, "I can't see how you could stand to be in the same room with him, let alone share an airplane."

"Because he's a damned fine flight instructor," I replied, "that's how."

Well, I did pick up tangentially that my CFI was in fact an atheist and, by Alabama standards a "screaming liberal" during our time together, but we were pretty careful to keep our conversations to flying. When we went "off topic," it was in safe areas like our kids, the hilarity of marriage, and funny stories about work (Engineer stories for him, Army stories for me). I would characterize our relationship as professional.

Now, then, if we had talked politics or religion we'd of been at extreme odds, and it would have colored the reason we were together in a harmful way. Rather than working cooperatively towards a goal, an element of adversity would have been introduced.

I'm just trying to keep the same vibe here. Heck, you're a VW guy, and I'd love for you to go to my Nieuport thread and give your insight on my Diehl case over charging issue, and would accept your opinion with gratitude. More importantly, I'd like to keep the friendly Internet style relationship we have intact to where you'd want to.

[rwanttaja]

"He's an atheist and a screaming liberal," the man said, "I can't see how you could stand to be in the same room with him, let alone share an airplane."

"Because he's a damned fine flight instructor," I replied, "that's how."

I've known my best friend for ~45 years, we were CAP cadets together. We were best man at each other's weddings. One of the happiest days of my life was witnessing his wife pinning his first star onto his epaulet.

Yet we are on opposite ends of the political spectrum. If the conversation strays into something political, one of us says, "Ummm..." and changes the subject.

Sadly, the world seems to be lacking this kind of tolerance. Used to be that politicians from opposite sides of the fence could be friends. Not allowed, anymore; they'll be labeled traitors. A local extremist politician was asked about friends at the opposite side of the political spectrum. She was outraged that anyone could imagine she could be friends with one of "them."

Years ago, military officers' associations (such as the officer's mess in the Army or Wardroom in the Navy) imposed certain limits on discussion topics to avoid acrimonious debates in their closed societies. The basic rule was, "No discussion of politics, religion, or women." Not a bad rule, for forums that are dedicated to a particular topic.

Ron Wanttaja

[Bill Greenwood]

Frank, a good story, but not the case on our forum and topic. Where do you find in anything I wrote any debate on religion or even one about being liberal/conservative? I'll bet you $20 you cant find anything I wrote on religion except maybe one story/joke from a CFI forum at OSH. But if youve never prayed in an airplane, youve probably never been scared, or never had a friend or family reported missing or overdue or one who is dealing with cancer.

[krw920]

Frank, a good story, but not the case on our forum and topic. Where do you find in anything I wrote any debate on religion or even one about being liberal/conservative? I'll bet you $20 you cant find anything I wrote on religion except maybe one story/joke from a CFI forum at OSH. But if youve never prayed in an airplane, youve probably never been scared, or never had a friend or family reported missing or overdue.

Bill, it's not all about YOU!

Kurt W.

[Frank Giger]

Bill, my post wasn't directed at you in any way.

[Bill Greenwood]

Then who was the person it is directed at? ?

[Floatsflyer]

Then who was the person it is directed at? Is there some other person on here who is not afraid of people having a mind and opinion and who is critisized for it?

There's something happening here
But what it is ain't exactly clear.

Paranoia strikes deep
Into your life it will creep.
It starts when you're always afraid
The men will come and take you away.

Bill, refer to #34 and take heed. This is fast becoming One Flew Over the Cuckoos Nest, something I'm sure no one wants to see.

[robert l]

I just watched "Cool Hand Luke" again the other night. "What we got here, is failure to communicate" ! I just wasted 15 min. reading all this, I'm done. LOL
Bob

[Frank Giger]

Then who was the person it is directed at? ?

Bill, always look at a quoted section in a post - it was to 1600VW.

[jethro99]

I hope the flight surgeon does not read this post. Could be hazardous to one getting his medical approved. Failed due to mental issues. Not fit to fly. Judgement is clouded.