Bill, clearly we're writing past each other.
No offense meant, I just think we should keep topics aviation related, even tangentially, here.
Bill, clearly we're writing past each other.
No offense meant, I just think we should keep topics aviation related, even tangentially, here.
The opinions and statements of this poster are largely based on facts and portray a possible version of the actual events.
This could be the problem....Originally Posted by Frank Giger
Let's just assume we engaged in a huge back-and-forth about validity of one person's opinion over another's, engaging in oneupmanship, eventually invoked Godwin's law, and absolutely failed to reach agreement on anything other than we disagree with each other on this one matter. It will save us both time and words.
I have no desire to go through that nutroll - as pilots and builders we have so much in common that it would be a harmful exercise - a point that I very poorly tried to bring across.
Here's an example of how non-aviation stuff can ruin an otherwise beautiful aviation relationship:
My CFI was great. I say that because in style of teaching and his ability to gauge a student's actual progress really meshed with mine. In fact, he was my second CFI, as I fired my first one - a young man who was a good CFI but very quiet and reserved, speaking very rarely and completely unflappable. This also made him unreadable and I had no idea what I was doing right or wrong most of the time.
So I interviewed another, and grinned at the first bit of sarcasm. My CFI was quick to give feedback both good and bad, laid out specific goals and was very honest on how well I met them. His goal was to train me to my check ride, yes, but it was clear he wanted me to be a good pilot overall, to look at the whole of flying, and put things into context. We got along famously, very professionally, even though we used a bit of "vernacular" to pepper our conversations. I can't say we became friends; the only reason we spent time together is because I was handing over a handful of cash for the privilege. However, it was never a chore (at least not for me), and we gained respect for each other.
One day I was talking to one of my pilot friends and mentioned my CFI with a glowing review of his abilities to teach a knucklehead like me how to fly and I got a very sour look.
"He's an atheist and a screaming liberal," the man said, "I can't see how you could stand to be in the same room with him, let alone share an airplane."
"Because he's a damned fine flight instructor," I replied, "that's how."
Well, I did pick up tangentially that my CFI was in fact an atheist and, by Alabama standards a "screaming liberal" during our time together, but we were pretty careful to keep our conversations to flying. When we went "off topic," it was in safe areas like our kids, the hilarity of marriage, and funny stories about work (Engineer stories for him, Army stories for me). I would characterize our relationship as professional.
Now, then, if we had talked politics or religion we'd of been at extreme odds, and it would have colored the reason we were together in a harmful way. Rather than working cooperatively towards a goal, an element of adversity would have been introduced.
I'm just trying to keep the same vibe here. Heck, you're a VW guy, and I'd love for you to go to my Nieuport thread and give your insight on my Diehl case over charging issue, and would accept your opinion with gratitude. More importantly, I'd like to keep the friendly Internet style relationship we have intact to where you'd want to.
The opinions and statements of this poster are largely based on facts and portray a possible version of the actual events.
Frank, your post # 24 on page 3 doesnt mention 1600 at all,. It does talk about things not on the forum. I may not hope for as narrow a focus as you do for the forum, but I can read precisely what people write. .I just think people should be more friendly on the forum, and not intolerant and critical.
Yes, I have written a few things that are general interest, just like someones( may have been Floats) recent joke about 3 men in a boat. Not all that funny, but so what no harm done.By the way, when I heard that joke after one of the men walked on water back to the shore to get the beer the other 2 asked him what the secret of walking on water was and the said. " You have to know where the rocks are"
If most of us,not Ron of course, were sharing a table at Osh Ill bet the conversation would be friendly and polite no matter if the topic was cotter keys, atc privatization, or safety netting at baseball stadiums. We could even debate why Texas Bar B Q sauce is so much better than that mayo with garlic from your part of the country.
Last edited by Bill Greenwood; 09-22-2017 at 02:41 PM.
The supposed "white BBQ sauce" isn't. And I don't know anyone who would touch such an abomination here in Alabama.
The opinions and statements of this poster are largely based on facts and portray a possible version of the actual events.
Not at any particular table you pick, and not at any particular time you choose.
If you're at a welding forum at Airventure and loudly start to talk about the current political crisis, expect to be shut down quickly. If there's a roadable-airplane forum and you start loudly discussing your favorite BBQ sauce, expect some criticism. If Burt Rutan is presenting at a new design forum and you start to expound your excitement about the Indianapolis 500, expect to be shown the door really quickly.
Look at the common word in these three sentences: "Forum." Now, scroll up all the way to the URL. What does it say? "EAAFORUMS." What does the tab just below it say? "Forum".
If you want to chat about any other subject, join any of the myriad chat rooms or get EAA to start one. But the EAA Forums are intended to discuss aviation.
Ron Wanttaja
Last edited by rwanttaja; 09-22-2017 at 01:33 PM.
Ron, apparently my ideas, which seem common, are hostile to you, I wrote "freindly and polite" re sharing a table at Oskosh and you commented on "loudly" which is your word not what I wrote. I have met many people over 34 years at Osh and shared many a table, or tram with all kinds of folks, and cant recall any that were so upset at others. And Ive given a number of forums at Osh and Sun N Fun, and attended many others and never seen anyone shout down someone, even at the FAA one when there were hot topics. Icould say all EAA folks are nice, but that seems to upset you. They have been nice to me, with few exceptions, Yeager, whom many others have had problems with. As for wrting about Indy 500, it has lots of tie in to aviation, from fly overs by friends and EAA members to the first lady to race there, Janet Gutherie who is a pilot and friend. Even the ar B Q topic,all 20 words was related to the cafe at Osh, and Frank got that. This forum is by EAA, not Ron, and they felt my topic fit. My last post was addressed to Frank and do you think it would be better if you didnt read anything I wrote or us comment on each others post? I dont think we've ever met or if you even go to Osh but it seems like Packers vs Bears here.
Last edited by Bill Greenwood; 09-22-2017 at 04:00 PM.
Floats, fine with me if you post all the jokes you want, even that one which had nothing to do with aviation. I heard some funnier jokes at Osh, but they are all x rated, often sexist or racist or political or all three and not ones I will reapeat I do wish we had a topic just for humor on this forum. And where do you define the line between a discussion, even one that disagrees and a fight, as per your word.
Re-read what I wrote, Bill. I referred to speaking loudly off-topic during someone else's forum. If you're at a private table with friends, talk about what you want, but when dozens or hundreds of people show up for a forum on a given topic, the discussion at that forum should be that topic alone.
Re-read... oh, cripes, actually READ what I wrote, Bill. I referred to people showing up at a forum and attempting to drive the discussion in another direction. Not people sitting on a tram, or a picnic table in a non-forum area.
Did the heated discussion have to do with the topic itself? That's not what I'm referring to. What I'm referring to is someone showing up and trying to hijack an official forum with another topic. If the topic is FAA regulation, I would expect things to get heated. But if they're having a discussion about FARs, no one should be jumping up demanding a discussion of our policy with North Korea. Like you have tried to introduce here.
The fact is, over ~50 years or so, there have probably been disruptions at EAA forums at Rockford/Oshkosh/Airventure. I suspect EAA is attuned to handling the problem.
Well, who is the moderator of this forum? Is it Janet Guthrie? Is it Chuck himself? Is it Rudolph the Red-Nosed Raindeer?
Nope. It's Sam, and his boss, Hal. Neither Janet, Chuck, nor Rudy deleted your nuclear weapons post.
As I've said before, one can tie ANY subject into aviation. I think Sam's and Hal's actions cancelling several of your threads (and closing others) kind of indicates the kinds of subjects they expect here.
Now, consider. You've started several ON-topic threads lately. Have people tore into you? Complained? Called you names?
Nope. Think about that.
"What, and give up show business?"
Ron "The Aristocrats!" Wanttaja
[QUOTE=Bill Greenwood;65861Yes, I have written a few things that are general interest, just like someones( may have been Floats) recent joke about 3 men in a boat. Not all that funny, but so what no harm done.[/QUOTE]
Hey c'mon now. It's one thing to continually fight with me and all the others here about Forum appropriate subjects but when you question my sense of humour and joke quality, well that's an entirely different matter that I take really personally. That was a damn good joke!! Scores a 9 on the funny as hell scale.
Here's a buck and a half Bill, go buy a sense of humour.
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