Airlines Now

[DaleB]

I recently had an airline flight, and was surprised at how easy and almost human TSA was, not the usual hassle.

I'm sure those TSA workers have been discovered and fired by now.

[martymayes]

Bill I did a flight just a few weeks ago where we could have been airborne in 3 hrs and 5 min. To avoid risking a DOT +3 hr rule violation, we had to return to gate, give pax a "de-boarding opportunity" then continue which took another 55 min. Now, I'm not that good with math but it seems to me 3:05 delay is less than 4:00 delay. The extra delay was unintended consequence of the rule.

[Frank Giger]

I recently had an airline flight, and was surprised at how easy and almost human TSA was, not the usual hassle. Maybe that was a laid back California type attitude?

It's airport by airport, and even time of day.

At Atlanta one is just another cow through the chute, and any wrinkle is met with annoyance.

At Birmingham it's smiles and waves.

At Las Vegas it's a mix of both - though I'm sure they make sure that people don't get too pissed off coming or leaving there.

I'd take any rudeness from NYC, Chicago, etc., TSA folks as just being a product of their Yankee upbringing, where civility isn't a strong suit.

On Greyhound, it's always been scary as hell. I spent two days on a bus that seemed to be full of convicts just released from prison, people clearly running from something, and all manner of ne'er do wells back in the 1980's. But they all were wearing shoes, not flip flops and no socks at least.

Frank "I've f***ing been to f****ing New f****ing Jersey" Giger

[martymayes]

Can you think of any other business that claims they had the right to hold people

Apparently the cruise line ships can. In 2013 the carnival ship triumph stranded people in the GOM for ~70 hrs. Sewage back up and spilled onto the deck, no power or air conditioning.....doesn't seem the airlines are all that bad. And this has happened several times.

[Mayhemxpc]

I was on a United flight once to Geneva, I think. We were absolutely going to hit the three hour delay (weather) and the captain taxi'd us back. He said it would really just be a few more minutes but said he had to give anyone who wanted the chance to de-plance. I was in business and I could not care less. i had food, drink, and a nice reclining seat. I did feel bad for the people in "Economy", having suffered through similar there. Well the only person who insisted on getting off was the guy sitting next to me! He also wanted a different flight, which meant that everyone had to wait while the airline found his bag in the hold and unloaded it. Flight attendants were not happy. We weren't either, of course. An hour later we were able to take off. Fast forward eight hours, now on the ground in Geneva. FA comes up to me with a very nice sport jacket. Not mine, I say. Must belong to him -- pointing to the empty seat next to me. The smile on her face when she realized that the guy was in such a self-centered rush that he forgot his expensive jacket almost made the delay worthwhile. (Almost.)

[martymayes]

Correct! The 3 hr rule does nothing but cause additional delay. Sure, they meant well but knee-jerk rules are rarely well thought out.

[Bill Greenwood]

You know, an airline that has to squeeze to operate so that they only hold passengers on the airplane for 3 hours before begining the actual flight is not doing a very good job of planning. And the idea that the capitian says it is "only going to be a few more minutes" is probably, " alternate facts" to use a term in fashion these days instead of just saying Bulls..t. This ariline and this captain could not get off the ground in 3 hours, and now they want you to believe they know for sure that it will only be a few more minutes? The govt doesnt have to fine an airline, and if it left 10 min over the 3 hours proabably wouldnt.
How would you feel for instance if you had a reservation at top restarant for 8 pm, and you get there and they say, "our chef is not here, held up by weather on the road" and it will be few more minutes. And then at 11 pm, 3 hours later, the say once again it will only be a few more minutes. Are you willing to let them take advantage of you like that? Its only a few more minutes after only 3 hours wait!
What did P T Barnum say about a sucker?Would you be satisified if it took only 3 hours to go through TSA and then they told you it would be "only a few more minutes"? how about waiting 3 hours plus at baggage claim or on the curb for a taxi?
And as for as a flgiht to Genwva, the rule ,in orignal form didnt apply to overseas flights for 3 hours it may now.
There of course can be weather delays. but weather doesnt often go from CAVU to blizzard or hurricane without some notice that can be planned for.

[Mayhemxpc]

It does apply to overseas flights. The real challenge there is how it affects crew duty days. Yes, everyone knew about the weather closing in. We pulled out of the gate early to try to get out ahead of it. We got out, then had to wait. Shut down one engine, then to the holding box and shit down the other. With regard to whether it would have been only a few more minutes, I think he was telling the truth. The Capt was very good about keeping us informed at frequent intervals. I was also tracking weather and departures on flight aware and fore flight and listening in on cockpit comms (United has a feature for that on Channel 9 and many flight crew enable it even on the ground.) In fact, when we hit the 3 hour mark, planes were moving and being cleared for take-off. I can't remember our sequence but it was less than 20 when we had to go back. The moment that the passenger's bag was off and the cargo hatches shut we were cleared for push-back. So yes, I believe it would have been just a few more minutes.

I have been in delay situations where the airline was jerking us around, and I can tell the difference. My own experience, however, is that it is rarely the cockpit crew doing the jerking, but the gate agents. (In the spirit of full disclosure I come from an airline family and even flew as a regional first officer during my "mid-life crisis." Therefore, I may have a tendency to take the side of the flight deck in such things.)

[martymayes]

Swiss Air had a triple seven land at a remote Canadian airstrip last night and kept passengers on board for 12 hrs. Is this a planning failure?


Bill, how would one plan for "possible" meteorological events? If there is a 40% chance of a snow event in the NE corridor, cancel all flights? You won't be in business very long.

[jethro99]

The Air Lines - Where every customer is considered to be a criminal until he can prove his own innocence.