Airplane certified IFR capable by TC?

[Eric Brown]

I am trying to sell a 1966 C172 G. I'd like to say the airplane is IFR capable. It has the instrumentation and avionics required by FAR 91.205. However, the Cessna 172 TCDS (3A12) operation limitations does not indicate that the "G" model is approved for DAY NIGHT VFR IFR operation. This note does not appear on the operation limitations until the 1971 "L" model.
Is there a problem ???

[martymayes]

I am trying to sell a 1966 C172 G. I'd like to say the airplane is IFR capable. It has the instrumentation and avionics required by FAR 91.205. However, the Cessna 172 TCDS (3A12) operation limitations does not indicate that the "G" model is approved for DAY NIGHT VFR IFR operation. This note does not appear on the operation limitations until the 1971 "L" model.
Is there a problem ???

What that means is the 'kinds of operation' placard is required on "L" and subsequent model 172's. The placard did not give the airplane any more or less operating privilege. I'm not sure what the language "IFR capable" is supposed to accomplish in an advertisement? As a buyer, I would laugh at such a statement. That ranks up there with "glide-scope."

A savvy buyer is going to ask if the inspections required by 91.411/.413 been accomplished in the proceeding 24 calendar months. I don't think it will make a good impression by saying "they are capable of being done."

[Jim Hann]

Eric,

I own a 1957 Piper so I was curious. My TCDS (1A6) does not mention anything about IFR certificated or not. So, I went browsing through CAR 3 which is the basis for certification of both of our airplanes (look at the "Certification Basis" section on page 16 of your TCDS). I only found one mention that seems to be what we are looking for:

§ 3.750 Types of operation. The type ofoperation to which the airplane is limited shall beestablished by the category in which it has beenfound eligible for certification and by theequipment installed. (See Parts 42 and 43 of thischapter.)

So, you are limited to N(ormal) or U(tility) and what equipment is installed. Since we are now covered by 14CFR91.205, you need to meet those requirements. Beyond that, you need the inspections that Marty mentions to make the airplane legal. I'm not going to get into a debate over legal vs safe vs prudent vs everybodys' opinions. If the airplane meets 91.205 for IFR, you can say "IFR equipped" without it being untrue. If you also do the inspections you can say "IFR certificated" or "IFR approved" or whatever verbiage you want and that would be a true statement.

Beyond all that, if you are saying those things as a buyer I would expect all of the required equipment to be working and be able to easily verify the a/c status in the logbooks. Clear as mud?

If you want to take a look at CAR 3 here is the link on the Navioneer site: http://www.navioneer.org/riprelay/Ye.../car_part3.pdf
It is a lot shorter read than the current 14CFR23 that newer aircraft are certificated under.

Good luck selling your airplane.