Flying the Fisk Arrival

[steve]

While we're talking about this year's event - Sunday morning arrival was a zoo because pilots were not established at 1800 feet before Ripon. They were descending THROUGH the low 1100 foot ceiling on the way to Fisk. I can only assume they were following the GPS railroad tracks on their way down to 1800'. Nothing like having an airplane just appear next to you like the Cheshire Cat.
Then there was the runway 18R left traffic approach in use (close in and descending all the time). I remember seeing at least 2 aircraft on a parallel downwind with me. I'm not sure they even came in from Fisk.

[Low Pass]

And there are those brain dead people who self directed themselves from the base or final on 27 to 18R. Their time is of course, more important.

[FlyingRon]

My one arrival this year when the NOTAM was in effect (usually I come and go several times giving rides) was while instructing Snowbird 10 how to do the procedure. He'd actually read the NOTAM months earlier.

[Mayhemxpc]

That is very cool Ron. A real Oshkosh memory. I understand from talking to those that did it that the Warbirds Arrival was also messed up on Sunday. I came in on Saturday, myself. Smooth as silk. Confirmed me in my belief that Saturday is the day to arrive and set up. (Unfortunately, I cannot afford to use Ron's technique and arrive WAY before then.)

[TedK]

While we're talking about this year's event - Sunday morning arrival was a zoo because pilots were not established at 1800 feet before Ripon. They were descending THROUGH the low 1100 foot ceiling on the way to Fisk. I can only assume they were following the GPS railroad tracks on their way down to 1800'. Nothing like having an airplane just appear next to you like the Cheshire Cat.
.

Holy Cow! That might explain why Fisk Approach seemed to be talking a lot about airplanes side by side approaching Fisk. If there were morons descending thru IMC into what is the densest traffic in the USA, then you would probably be within your rights to have a top turret gunner to deal with that threat.

i hope you filled out a NASA ASRS form so that somebody might look into this.

[Low Pass]

Holy Cow! That might explain why Fisk Approach seemed to be talking a lot about airplanes side by side approaching Fisk. If there were morons descending thru IMC into what is the densest traffic in the USA, then you would probably be within your rights to have a top turret gunner to deal with that threat.

i hope you filled out a NASA ASRS form so that somebody might look into this.

I'm not being sarcastic, but I am very curious that this surprises you. Have you make the arrival to Oshkosh on a busy day?? Having airplanes appear on the Ripon to Fisk leg - either out of the clouds, your blind spot, or beaming in from nowhere - is typical and should be expected. It's a three dimensional event. You would be well advised to be looking above, below and all around.

Attached is a screen shot of the traffic 45 nm se of Oshkosh. I turned off the traffic not long after this pic was taken.

[TedK]

I've only flown the Fisk approach four times so I still count myself as a OSH neophyte. But one of those times was with low ceilings. And yes, I get it that traffic comes from everywhere, but there is absolutely no excuse for a let down through the goo under VFR anywhere, much less anywhere near the OSH VFR arrivals area.

Why does this surprise me? Because it is flat out illegal and an absolutely egregious violation. The great majority of those headed to and from OSH play by the rules and view the sky as something we share with our fellow aviators. If there are those who think they can simply plunk down thru the goo with impunity, then they need to have their wings clipped before they clip someone else.

[Floatsflyer]

I'm not being sarcastic, but I am very curious that this surprises you. Have you make the arrival to Oshkosh on a busy day?? Having airplanes appear on the Ripon to Fisk leg - either out of the clouds, your blind spot, or beaming in from nowhere - is typical and should be expected. It's a three dimensional event. You would be well advised to be looking above, below and all around.

Attached is a screen shot of the traffic 45 nm se of Oshkosh. I turned off the traffic not long after this pic was taken.

This is precisely the reason we've been flying into Green Bay for many years. No fuss, no muss, no anxiety, no aggravation, no scared s**tless, no mid-airs, no memorizing a 50 page notam, no one calling my family to say I won't be coming home.

I flew into Osh in 1981, don't remember much except I was much, much younger at that time and thought I was invincible(and had no kids)so being one of a thousand locusts in the sky at once I deemed pretty damn exciting.

I understand why you turned off your active traffic. I have it on my PFD and MFD and with that
level of overwhelming, I would have done likewise and just looked outside 100%. It's a fantastic tool to have when it's manageable. I wonder also why you didn't declutter to just show the targets?

[dougbush]

Attached is a screen shot of the traffic 45 nm se of Oshkosh. I turned off the traffic not long after this pic was taken.

Screenshots like that are extremely misleading, because the icons are not to scale. Anyone looking at that area in real life would see empty sky with the occasional aircraft.

[Low Pass]

This is precisely the reason we've been flying into Green Bay for many years. No fuss, no muss, no anxiety, no aggravation, no scared s**tless, no mid-airs, no memorizing a 50 page notam, no one calling my family to say I won't be coming home.

I flew into Osh in 1981, don't remember much except I was much, much younger at that time and thought I was invincible(and had no kids)so being one of a thousand locusts in the sky at once I deemed pretty damn exciting.

I understand why you turned off your active traffic. I have it on my PFD and MFD and with that
level of overwhelming, I would have done likewise and just looked outside 100%. It's a fantastic tool to have when it's manageable. I wonder also why you didn't declutter to just show the targets?

As mentioned by Doug, it wasn't that bad where I took the screen shot. Actually, I could only see the guys in my flight. I show it to demonstrate that planes are out there, all around. And it's a pretty interesting pic to those not knowing the scale and having used these traffic displays (can't see anyone closer than 1-3 miles).

Why did I turn it off and not adjust the filter? Because I was in a flight of seven and you can't use this type of thing to deconflict with traffic arriving at Oshkosh. Need your eyes and timely response. And being in a flight I didn't want to fool around with the settings - just turned it off (we were in route).

My limits changed this year and I'll not be arriving Sunday afternoon next time. Saturday or even Friday maybe. My concerns came at the airport, not during the arrival sequence.

As for the overall risk, it's still not that bad. 10,500 planes (is that the count this year?) arrived and left with zero mid-airs and no fatal accidents. I believe there were a couple enroute, but this isn't attributable to the large concentration of planes at the fly in.

I studied this once a few years back and based on recollection, I believe there are about 0.5 fatal accidents per year and the vast majority were at the field, on or adjacent to the runway. I recall finding no report of mid airs arriving at the show.