Concealed Weapon Carry and Aviation

[Dekef4]

Your enthusiasm for "common sense" rationalizing makes me very curious about 3 things that I hope you'll answer:

Why would a fully qualified pilot hired to fly airplanes so willingly accept the added and far lesser(and more dangerous) role of armed security guard?

Were you provided with proper and formal training to carry out the armed security role?

As a non-military commercial pilot flying presumably for a private company(unless it was Air America), what places were you flying to that required the need for armed security?

Sorry about all the BS you've gotten in response to a straight forward and honest question on this topic! First check your state laws on concealed carry they define where you cannot carry. Some states exclude airports. Next check with the airport authority that is in question as they may possibly prohibit even when state law does not. CC is different than Transporting. In most cases you can Transport (unloaded and cased) as long as you do not enter a SIDA area. Only law enforcement or military can carry inside any SIDA area. This is the part of the airport where commercial part 121 and some 135 operations are conducted. Charter and scheduled operations. If in doubt unload it,case it, and lock in the trunk or glove box and you should be fine.

[Mike M]

Why do I get the idea that Floatsflyer has never read the U.S. Constitution? and likes to check that others are "properly trained" and has a "true" need to defend themselves. These types are called "The Enforcer". Bet I could guess which political party he belongs to. Probably the wrong place to make such statements but I just can't resist when such questions are put forth. For your info: I carry concealed because it is my right to do so; I need no other reason that that; have you ever watched the news lately?

Can of worms there. Obergefell v Hodges last summer decided that all persons anywhere in USA jurisdiction can exercise Constitutional rights everywhere in the USA with the lowest level restrictions applicable to any person anywhere. Sooner or later someone will realize that all Constitutional rights must have equal protection or none do. Stand by for heavy weather.

[FlyingRon]

Can of worms there. Obergefell v Hodges last summer decided that all persons anywhere in USA jurisdiction can exercise Constitutional rights everywhere in the USA with the lowest level restrictions applicable to any person anywhere. Sooner or later someone will realize that all Constitutional rights must have equal protection or none do. Stand by for heavy weather.

But understand airports will always be a sensitive area like federal buildings, court houses, etc... You are dangerously sticking your head in the sand if you think that the this is going to change and Obergefell doesn't set precedence here (though it indicates the sense of the current court into such matters). If you're going to travel somewhere by car or by air, it behooves you to understand what the local laws are in each place. As stated, lots of podunk airports have scheduled air service and it would be far to easy to wander into the SIDA from the airside. Further, as I pointed out earlier, some states like Virginia, make it illegal to carry on the "dirty" side of security as well.

[kinger]

With respect to your self-admitted long time non-flying circumstances, I'm puzzled by your current peculiar and unique concern.

Jerry Seinfeld, in one of his stand-up routines, said, "now they show you how detergents take out bloodstains. I think if you've got a shirt with a big bloodstain all over it, maybe laundry isn't your biggest problem."

Likewise, if you haven't flown for years and are seriously interested in flying again and becoming current, maybe asking if you can carry a concealed weapon in an airplane isn't your biggest problem.

Instead of being funny and conceited be quite or be helpful.

[Floatsflyer]

Why do I get the idea that Floatsflyer has never read the U.S. Constitution? and likes to check that others are "properly trained" and has a "true" need to defend themselves. These types are called "The Enforcer". Bet I could guess which political party he belongs to. Probably the wrong place to make such statements but I just can't resist when such questions are put forth. For your info: I carry concealed because it is my right to do so; I need no other reason that that; have you ever watched the news lately?

Whoa there Freddy boy! You're making a lot of assumptions and conclusions that reflect your negative state of arrogance, attitude, ignorance and knowledge.

Actually, I have read and know quite a few parts of the U.S. Constitution. I never needed to, I was a poli sci major, I like to absorb knowledge and I'm Canadian. Is the 2nd Amendment all you know or care about?

I'll bet the value of your truck that you know nothing of my constitution-I'm Canadian.

I'll bet the value of your gun rack, boots, buckle and hat that you could not guess what political party I support--I'm Canadian.

For your edification, you DO NOT have the right to carry concealed. You DO have the right TO APPLY for a permit for such carry. There is no guarantee that one will be approved. Perhaps you may possess the cranial capacity to distinguish the difference. Perhaps not.

And yes, I do watch the news-- yours, mine and the world. Canadians are not xenophobic(you can look it up). Yours is particularly sad and distressing.

[rwanttaja]

For your edification, you DO NOT have the right to carry concealed. You DO have the right TO APPLY for a permit for such carry.

Loath as I am to perpetuate a gun brawl, but: The US Constitution states that the right to bear arms shall not be infringed. Whether that applies to civilian weapons, military weapons, individual citizens, state militias, private militias, tactical nukes, open carry, concealed carry, cannon-armed Kitfoxes, or whatever is subject to interpretation by various bureaucrats and courts.

Ron Wanttaja

[Floatsflyer]

Loath as I am to perpetuate a gun brawl, but: The US Constitution states that the right to bear arms shall not be infringed. Whether that applies to civilian weapons, military weapons, individual citizens, state militias, private militias, tactical nukes, open carry, concealed carry, cannon-armed Kitfoxes, or whatever is subject to interpretation by various bureaucrats and courts.

Ron Wanttaja

All true Ron, no argument as far as the multitude of interpretations at Supreme and state level courts. But Freddie boy wrongly claims he has the "right" to carry concealed and I said he clearly does not because he must submit an application which can be denied. For Freddie boy's circumstances here's the applicable rules, regs, qualifications and requirements for New Mexico:

http://www.usacarry.com/new_mexico_c...formation.html

[Mike M]

"Whether that applies ... is subject to interpretation by various bureaucrats and courts."

"...wrongly claims he has the "right" to carry concealed ... does not because he must submit an application which can be denied...here's the applicable rules, regs, qualifications and requirements for New Mexico"

Uh, so what? From the same source as the New Mexico requirements:

"Arizona has passed a new “Arizona Constitutional Carry” law that went into effect on July 29, 2010. This law means that as long as you are legally able to own a firearm and is 21 year of age or older, you can carry concealed in the State of Arizona without a concealed weapon permit.... Arizona is a Shall Issue State and issues concealed weapon permits to residents of Arizona as well as out-of-state/non-residents." And Vermont's law, "It is lawful to carry a firearm openly or concealed provided the firearm is not carried with the intent or avowed purpose of injuring a fellow man. There is no permit required to carry concealed."

And from the Supreme Court:

"The idea of the Constitution was to withdraw certain subjects from the vicissitudes of political controversy, to place them beyond the reach of majorities and officials and to establish them as legal principles to be applied by the courts. This is why fundamental rights may not be submitted to a vote; they depend on the outcome of no elections.”

We can be married in any county and regardless of state or local laws forbidding it we're married everywhere. It's a Constitutional right since 26 June 2015. Substitute "carry" for "marry" and "carrying" for "married" and your mileage may vary? No, I don't want to be the test case, but the Court's meaning was crystal clear regarding the right of the individual not to be injured by the unlawful exercise of governmental power. So marry your buddy, carry a firearm where you want, have the speed dial for a good lawyer, go before you go and wear clean underwear when you leave the house.

[Mayhemxpc]

The answer again and again is: "Check the law." Can you carry openly? Check the law? Can you have ready access to the gun in your plane but must unload and secure it when leaving the plane? Check the law. (I actually know of one jurisdiction which says you MUST carry openly outside of your car -- box and locked is not good enough.) Is your plane considered your "curtilage" when on an airport? Probably, but check the local laws.

The discussion was not whether you should, whether it was a good idea, or whether to say go ahead because no one will find out. The question was whether someone could legally do something. The first principle of rule of law may be commonly violated as of late, but the second rule -- that the law should be accessible to all, seems to be still in effect. There are various websites that can be used, even if they may not particularly apply to general aviation.

For Floats -- didn't there used to be a Canadian law that when overflying certain remote areas that there MUST be a survival firearm on board? (I might be confused with Alaska.)

PS: I fly a plane that has a rifle rack as standard equipment!

[Taylordragger]

Carry your gun. Keep it concealed, where appropriate, so as not to offend those who who don't get the idea of freedom....to protect yourself, and likely to fly one of those dangerous airplanes. My gosh, somebody could get hurt!