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Thread: Sport Pilot

  1. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by martymayes View Post
    Gee Tony, one CFI's opinion is not representative of ALL FAA certificated CFI's. Perhaps this particular CFI has no understanding of Sport Pilot nor any interest in providing SP instruction. He is free to do that you know.....
    You know you are correct. This is the only man in the country who feels this way. Every flight school in America offers this SP training and not one person in America is having any problems getting a SP certificate or the training needed to get this certificate. CFI's are falling over each other racing to each new student to offer this training.

    I don't believe I said I was quoting every or ALL CFI in America. I stated what one CFI said. It's you who wants to make this about every CFI in the country. But this does show that we have those who feel a certain way about certain aviation Certificates. The guys flying the Heavy's look down on those who fly GA. Those flying GA look down on those who fly SP. It keeps going. If you don't believe this just look at what happened with the Airline pilots and the 3rd class medical. That letter that the airline pilots association sent off shows this lack of camaraderie between the different classes of aviation Certificates. Its a they are better then us type of thinking. IMHO.

    People who think like this are called...Snobs.

    snob
    snäb/
    noun
    noun: snob; plural noun: snobs

    • a person with an exaggerated respect for high social position or wealth who seeks to associate with social superiors and dislikes people or activities regarded as lower-class.
      • a person who believes that their tastes in a particular area are superior to those of other people.
        "a musical snob"


      Tony
    Last edited by 1600vw; 08-07-2015 at 07:21 AM.

  2. #12

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    It's encouraging to hear from a few people here that have pursued some form of sport pilot training. I hope more chime in. But I can make some recommendations that might help out as you begin your training.

    a) get knowledgeable about the certificate you are after. Especially if it is light sport. Read over 61.301 thru 61.327 and the Sport Pilot PTS (available for free at faa.gov). If you don't know what your training should contain and your CFI isn't particularly up on it, at the worst you will see them pushing you toward the PPL, and at the best, they will be running up your bill and wasting your time by training you up on stuff that's in the PPL PTS instead of the Sport Pilot PTS.

    b) don't be afraid to fly with different instructors. If your CFI realizes that's he is the only fish in your pond, you've handed him a blank check. A lot of the young CFIs are more concerned about how their record looks than if you are ready to take the check ride. I have experienced this in every rating that I trained for. It really burns me up, but I've had at least one CFI in each rating (2 in the sport CFI training) that was afraid that I would bust and make them look bad. Keep it about your training by flying with some other guys, because in the end, it's really about economy. They need the money and the time in their books, they just think that they need the 100% pass record from their students.

    I am really close to retiring my first log book and starting my second one. So this thread has prompted me to go back and count up how many different instructors that I've flown with through the years. I guess I'm a numbers guy, but I found it pretty astounding. I've flow with 18 different instructors (I had a little training in the 80's, but seriously got after it in 1998). 5 different instructors preparing for my PPL. One guy that moved away just before I was ready to solo, one that was desperately afraid of either me or my plane, one that was super worried that I would tarnish his record, but was otherwise a great instructor, and one that desperately needed a student that stood a chance of passing the check ride. Care to guess which one signed me off? 5 different instructors preparing for the commercial checkride. One that I was looking forward to working more with, but he departed early, 3 guys that were worried about their bust ratio, 2 of them were infuriating little children who were so confounded by the fact that I already knew how to fly and it wasn't like all their other students from the 'local' school that they kept wasting my time trying to change all my basics, and one guy that I'm now great friends with who told me I was ready and to get on along to the check ride. Then 7 different instructors while working on my Sport CFI, 2 guys that provided insurance check outs and no training, a great fellow that helped me with spin training and tail wheel flying, another friend and CFI who finished up my tail wheel endorsement along with providing 7 of my BFRs through the years, 2 guys who didn't think I could pass and tried to get me to spend money on 10 more hours of ground training to pad their pockets because 'hey their last CFI candidate put in 35 hours of ground training, you can give us 10..', and my friend whom I have a lot of respect for and mentioned earlier who flew with me once and looked at some of my ground work and lesson plans and said 'those guys are nuts, I'll sign you off right now'.

    So keep your eyes out for those guys who want to hang out in your pocket book, but also look until you find the guys that are making pilots. They are the ones that you really want on your side.
    Last edited by 67jwbruce; 08-07-2015 at 09:29 AM.

  3. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckiec View Post
    I know how the OP feels. I live on Long Island and you would think with all the flight schools there would be many choices for sport pilot. Unfortunately there was only one school and their LSA fleet has dwindled to a single Skycatcher. I was politely told I was too fat to fly in it so the prospect was lose 25-30 lbs or find an alternative. The only other school could find was in CT, an hour drive and 1 hour ferry ride but they had a Remos. I finally just broke down and bought my own plane, an E-LSA Zodiac CH601 that can carry my (now 250#) carcass, an instructor and gas. Based on what I have seen the sport pilot certificate just doesn't seem to have taken off the way it was predicted. I'd be willing to guess there are as many or more private pilots flying LSAs for one reason or another than new sport pilot only pilots.
    Yup, great observations Chuck. Obviously, a flight school can't put a $150k+ LSA trainer on the flight line (much less 2 or 3) and look at it. If nobody shows up to fly, I would NOT expect it to stay around for long. What's the reason the plane(s) didn't fly? I would think a flight school trying to promote LSA would not have instructors on staff refusing to give sport pilot training, those worried about their careers. I can believe that people didn't flood in to take sport pilot flight training only because no medical is required, despite industry/alphabet group predictions otherwise. The hourly cost for sport pilot training is still quite steep. And there are plenty of other competing recreational activities. Getting more people involved in flying is going to take more than a simplified pilot certification but some have said that all along. :-|

    BTW, congrats on your plane purchase and good luck with your training! I'm glad you kept pursuing despite the obstacles!

  4. #14

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    This is a timely thread for me. I just got back from being at AirVenture and 'once again' I'm pumped up on getting a Sport Pilot cert. I feel I'm interested in Sport Pilot for the right reasons. The type of flying I most want to do (low and slow around the patch type stuff) and the type of aircraft I'm interested in building and flying (Hummel H5 LSA).

    However, though there was plenty of encouragement from EAA at AirVenture regarding Sport Pilot there seems to be little encouragement out in the 'real world'. Even after years of implementation Sport Pilot still seems to be a rather obscure rating. At several Forums I attended at Osh there were folks that expressed how difficult it 'still is' to get SP instruction. Perhaps one of the more disturbing sentiments expressed that I personally heard was that some felt a Sport Pilot rating is being looked down upon as 'inferior' (in comparison to a Private Pilots License) and a 'waste of time' (why bother, just get a PPL, so to speak). That sentiment kinda bum's me out. It reminds me of the whole 'mine is bigger than yours' crap. You know, for instance, in the medical field it was not uncommon to see Doctors 'naturally' look down on Nurses, nurses look down on Paramedics, Paramedics look down on EMT's, EMT's look down on First Aid cert owners etc. Unfortunately all for no other reason than to stick out a chest and raise a nose to those 'beneath you' rather than sharing a common thread of medicine and caring for others. Is that the case in GA when it comes to Sport Pilot? Geez, I really hope not. I'd rather that someone looking to obtain a Sport Pilots License be looked apon as a fellow aviation enthusiast and an opportunity to grow the aviation community.

    I love aviation, always have. 25 years ago I had the time and money to pursue a PPL. Unfortunately, as is often the case, I ran out of both not long after soloing. But I loved it and, as with many of you I'm sure, I will never forget that day my instructor said, your ready, she's yours, now take her up!

    Anyhow, I'm back home (near San Diego), recently retired from the Fire Department and once again with the time and money to pursue my dream, but I'm half expecting to be a bit discouraged as I look into it more.

  5. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by 1600vw View Post
    This is the only man in the country who feels this way.
    Doesn't matter if it's 1 or 100. Or even 1000. There's plenty of other instructors out there. I can assure you the majority of sport pilot authorized instructors are not bashing LSA. That would be like a car salesman selling only luxury cars and turning up his nose at anything else. For sure, there are some people like that but if compact/economy cars are selling, there are plenty of other salesmen more than willing to sell them (The real problem here is we have this new category of plane and pilot but no steady stream of customers coming in the door).

    I fly an airliner and I don't look down on anyone. I try to do my part to promote recreational/light sport/GA flying. One of my pet peeves is those that over generalize about the LSA industry and sport pilot certificates in a negative way. Yup, some people don't like it. Big deal. Call them a snob or whatever, if they are not on board we don't need them. They are not going to make or break the industry.

  6. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike A View Post
    This is a timely thread for me. I just got back from being at AirVenture and 'once again' I'm pumped up on getting a Sport Pilot cert. I feel I'm interested in Sport Pilot for the right reasons. The type of flying I most want to do (low and slow around the patch type stuff) and the type of aircraft I'm interested in building and flying (Hummel H5 LSA).
    Good deal Mike. I would like to build an H5 as well. Don't give up!

  7. #17

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    To the OP, I think a Google search can turn up Flight Schools with LSA aircraft that will train for a SP certificate. Indy Sky Sports is one I found, and Indianapolis Flying Lessons is another (no affiliation to either).

    In terms of the SP certificate, it has been interesting getting feedback from the various flight schools in the LA/Orange County area about it. Most I spoke with really down-played the SP Certificate and the aircraft itself. One went so far as to call the SP Certificate "unsafe" and the light sport aircraft he had at his school "slow and incapable." I'm currently training for my SP certificate, and I couldn't disagree more with the sentiment I've experienced.

    Each pilot has to make his/her own decision as to what fulfills the mission. I chose Sport Pilot because it meets my mission, and the aircraft are economical to rent/operate. Will I pursue a Private Pilot certificate? Yes... in time and after I have practice and comfort using the SP privileges. But I fail to understand why many of the PP look unfavorably upon a SP.

  8. #18
    I, too, am working towards a SPL. I've already gotten the evil eye from a PP or two.

  9. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by VFR-on-top View Post
    I, too, am working towards a SPL. I'VE ALREADY GOTTEN THE EVIL EYE FROM A PP OR TWO.
    That's very discouraging to hear.

  10. #20

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    Try not to get discouraged, keep after it. You'd think that all the ups and downs in aviation were in altitude, but apparently not. I've related some of the attitudes I have come across in my training, not just my sport training, but all of it. Friday was definitely one of those days that reminded me that I really like this aviating thing. I got a call Friday afternoon, a fellow out of flying for a few years needing a Flight Review and Insurance check out for a club SkyCatcher. He was given my name; he paid for the flying, and paid me for the review too. In 17 years, that's never happened to me...

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