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Thread: Building a Nieuport 11...

  1. #181

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    Frank,
    That looks like it is going to be a blast to fly, are there many built like it?

    Ken

  2. #182

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    I'm not sure at the exact number of Graham Lee Nieuport 11's are out there, but I'd say over 20, but that's just in the USA. Of the Airdrome Airplanes N11's, mine is number two.

    On flying characteristics, the pilot reports all confirm they're fun to fly. Since they're representative aircraft, not replicas, lots of pilot friendly features are built in, namely a fatter airfoil, twin spars on the lower wings, gear moved back closer to the CG for easier ground handling, takeoffs and landings. Most have named the Champ as a good analog for how it performs.

    With a few exceptions. First, it's ground trimmed, so no trim adjustments in the air. Second, with no vertical stabilizer it's very easy to get into uncoordinated flight while attempting straight and level flight.

    From the KC Dawn Patrol page:

    All its got is a full flying rudder which,since it's not fixed and just kinda floats in place, gives you no built-in directional stability at all. What do that mean? It means that if you relax pressure on the rudder bar while flying, the plane can go into a skid or slip without you knowing it. In fact, torque will automagically do it for you if you're not on the bar and ON THE BALL (so to speak.) We all swear that we've been able to hear that "click" when we really get outta whack in a turn and bury the ball on one side or the other of the tube. If you don't pay CONSTANT ATTENTION to that little booger... It'll quickly and without warning, sneak up and bite you right in the ass.
    Here's the link with the full quote: http://www.kcdawnpatrol.org/question...and Advice....
    The opinions and statements of this poster are largely based on facts and portray a possible version of the actual events.

  3. #183

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    After looking at a lot of different options, all miserable, at how to put in the center ribs on the wings, I opted to simply put them just out from where the rear cabane meets the rear wing spars. The middle 8" gap will be filled with sheeting as is done with the Graham Lee Nieuports.

    Anyhow, here's the center ribs in place:





    Way back when before I committed to the idea of building a plane, I bought the rudder ("ruder") kit from Airdrome and built what could possibly be the lowest grade of acceptable ever achieved in a part - if I had remembered to mount the horn for attaching the rudder cables to it.


    I also had the Poly starter kit. I decided against the Poly system in favor of the Stewart system after reading the words "respirator," "gloves," and "hazard." But it did some with some fabric and tapes. Rather than digging into the Big Box of Covering Supplies, I figured I'd use that stuff (along with some of the water based glue Robert included) to learn something new.


    It's not quite enough fabric to properly cover it, but the high points of going around tight curves and around tubing was what I was after.





    Here's the tubing with the glue on the insides of the rudder. The glue on the bottom gusset is one part stupid and one part realizing that the fabric won't go all the way round down there. I didn't need to go all the way across like that.


    I used a Harbor Freight Special brush and wasn't really pleased with it. I dug into the giant Box of Stuff I have and went with a foam brush from there on out with much better results.





    Fabric worked into the initial glue by hand and a little iron magic, tacked with 200 degree little iron.


    The lesson learned is that when going around bends that I was working too close to the tube with the iron to shrink the fabric slightly to make it tight. Backing off a bit to the excess and drawing the fabric there kept puckers to a minimum. I still have a couple, but they're tiny and wound up not really showing when the other side was put on.





    Flipping it over, I was pleasantly surprised to see it looked a lot better than I thought it would!





    I put some passes at 250 degrees to take out the folds and tighten it slightly to make a smooth surface for the other side.


    The piece of remaining fabric was too small to reach all the way across the rudder. I decided to truncate the covering to the main spar and cover around the big curve in the back.


    The opinions and statements of this poster are largely based on facts and portray a possible version of the actual events.

  4. #184

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    Driving on...

    Here's the other side being glued on. Note the excess is wavy further in - nothing but one or two minor puckers past the glue line. I was pretty happy with myself.

    However, I should have extended the glue on it just past the glue line on the other side's fabric for making a clean cut of the excess cloth when I was done.



    Here it is trimmed, but the fabric is still loose.



    I worked up to 300 degrees to make it tight. It's like magic watching the folds and stuff disappear.



    I put in an inspection ring and taped for the inclusion of some rivets. Why an inspection ring on a rudder? Because I'll be putting them on the wings and fuselage later on and needed to see the level of PITA involved. It's not a great job...I mucked around right after placing it and it's not as tight around the ring as I'd like.



    Putting the tape over the rivets was pretty straight forward.



    A couple notes:

    1) I had bought the Stewart System instructional DVD set and aped what the man did on them as best I could. He proves that while the basics of covering really are pretty straight forward, to get really good requires practice.
    2) I had covered my work table with a tarp over night, as my tent is getting leaky again. It was dirty, and even though I wiped down the table after removing it, I still got dirt on the fabric. So I'll be covering the table with something clean before covering from now on out.
    3) I'm undecided on the edge tapes; I might put them on later, but it seems pretty straight forward and I don't want to dig into my supplies to practice with. Plus it's getting hot outside and I'm feeling lazy.
    The opinions and statements of this poster are largely based on facts and portray a possible version of the actual events.

  5. #185

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    So the fabric is sealed using some exterior latex primer:





    Finding the right mix of floteral and a dash of windshield wiper fluid was fairly easy, and only the first coat needed some light sanding. The others didn't and there isn't a trace of "orange peel" effect on it.


    I'd of painted it to final coat but it's been raining and windy, meaning my tarp roof sheds little bits of fabric; hopefully the roof will last until I get back from Kansas, as it's beginning to fray with the thunderstorms.


    One of the things I absolutely had to get done before the trip to Gardner, Kansas this weekend* was mounting the firewall so that I could get a template. Turns out it was a great idea done for a different reason! Here's the firewall on a big piece of cardboard:





    In figuring out where to drill the holes for the firewall it dawned on me that marking and fussing with a big metal sheet was a lot harder than working with a cardboard template - I could just punch holes in it with the scissors for where the engine mount bolts are.





    Made for quick work!


    Here's the firewall on with the engine mount over it.




    * This weekend is a big airshow focusing on WWI replicas at Gardner, Kansas. Not only will it be a great time watching airplanes, it'll be a huge wealth of information on questions I have on how to do some stuff. The guys from Valley Engineering will be there as well, and I'll be negotiating a price on a FWF rig and ordering it from them.


    With wind and rain picking up, I tabled mounting the firewall for when I get back.
    The opinions and statements of this poster are largely based on facts and portray a possible version of the actual events.

  6. #186

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    Can you elaborate on this as to what you are referring too?

    Finding the right mix of floteral and a dash of windshield wiper fluid was fairly easy, and only the first coat needed some light sanding. The others didn't and there isn't a trace of "orange peel" effect on it.

    Thanks
    Ken

  7. #187

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    Sure. If you walk up to a wall in your house that's painted, chances are it's not smooth, but has little ridges and valleys on it, kinda like the surface of an orange - hence the term "orange peel."

    Floteral smooths out the paint so that it flows even and gets rid of brush and roller marks. The directions for it say 8 ounces for a gallon, but for the tiny amounts I was using it was some guesswork. I won't bother trying to describe the consistency, but it isn't hard to spot when it's right - it's just smoother than paint from the can.

    The windshield fluid is a thinning agent, and I found that it wasn't that much to add to bring it down to a little more liquidy consistency. The idea is allow thin layers of paint that don't need sanding that are thick enough to seal the weave without saturating all the way through it.
    The opinions and statements of this poster are largely based on facts and portray a possible version of the actual events.

  8. #188

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    Clear enough, thanks

  9. #189

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    While I might sound all expert-y, I watched all the Stuart System videos on YouTube, then ordered the DVD's, and watched the EAA webinar on it.

    The webinar replay video:

    http://www.eaavideo.org/video.aspx?v=2735032127001

    I'm not going for the high gloss he achieved - mine is a fake warbird - the techniques are exactly the same excepting for a bunch of the sanding....and I won't be shooting any of it with a gun.
    The opinions and statements of this poster are largely based on facts and portray a possible version of the actual events.

  10. #190

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    Last weekend I went to Gardner, KS for the annual airshow that features WWI aircraft. First, how cool is an airshow just for WWI aircraft replicas? Second, if one shows up the day prior to the show on Friday the opportunity to help assemble the aircraft as they come off of trailers can't be missed. Everyone there is really friendly and happy to have a hand from another builder - we tend to understand how things go together, that fabric can be damaged with objects that can poke through them, and not to jumble bolts together randomly when helping taking them apart.

    I also learned I had rigged my own plane incorrectly! So after coming home I got to work fixing it...naturally there was some drama involved.

    First the plane had to come out of the tent and onto the grass for re-rigging.

    I had the rear top landing wire coming from the first compression strut to the right of the aileron horn, as there's a lifting tang there and the plans are less than verbose on rigging points.

    Not a problem, making steel lift tangs is nothing for Dixie Fabrication D'aéronefs!



    The front flying wire was originally located at the forward carry-through because A) a lift tang shimmed it perfectly and B) since the rear one is at the carry-through (no other place to put it) it made sense.

    Wrong. It goes forward, mounted on the bolt that holds the engine mount per Robert Baslee and Jeff Given' AA Nieuport 11.




    There's a fifth wire per side that goes from the front of the aircraft to the interplane strut to reinforce the lower wing due to the sweep. It's not in the plans and served as a nice "oh by the way" bit of information while I was at Gardner. I can either make tangs or use the eye ended AN-4 bolts that I bought extra; I'm agnostic on either way to do it and haven't decided.

    And then the hilarity set in, as I should have expected since rigging the right side went without a hitch - everything going smooth and the bubbles in the center.

    I had put all my wires on small lift tangs to allow me to completely remove them; covering will be a lot easier that way, and I won't have wires dangling from the parts when disassembled. I had not, however, tightened the turnbuckles when I put them up in a nice set of coils.

    Two of the barrels and forked ends came off in the twenty feet I carried them from hook on peg board to the chair I set them on. I found one pretty quickly, but the other remains at large.

    When I was at B&B Aircraft supply in Gardner I bought some turnbuckles for that fifth wire, plus two more for either the rudder cables or whatever. Maybe I could use those spares...but alas, they're too small.

    Quick call to Robert Baslee for the part number for the turnbuckle - this is day two of scouring the shed I stored the cables in and going over the grass with a magnet on my hands and knees like a mine sweeper - and he informed me of not only the part number (which he knew off the top of his head), but that I needed to use them on that fifth wire. He recommended calling B&B supply for them.

    But I want it over nighted, so I fire up the Aircraft Spruce site and plug in the assembly number. Fifty five dollars each. Cripes! Time to pull out that B&B business card and order three of them for forty-eight dollars. Yep, I think I can wait until Friday or Saturday for them.

    So there's some other stuff I'll be doing on the aircraft until then.
    The opinions and statements of this poster are largely based on facts and portray a possible version of the actual events.

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