Like I said, good to hear. I'm going to try to learn more about options, try to get into a project locally and go from there. I'm not even looking to buy a rudder kit right yet.Originally Posted by Ron Blum
I read through all of Frank Giger's thread on "Building a Nieuport 11"...it's a huge task and I love the WWI replicas, but I want to see other projects and get the scale of them in person.
That's one of the reasons I made that thread!
The best thing to do is visit your local EAA chapter(s) and ask for a visit to their builds or built aircraft. One thing I didn't fully appreciate when starting on my airplane building adventure is just how open and friendly the build community is. Whether it's a little putt-putt one man open cockpit plane like mine or a four place RV, everyone I've met has taken the time to explain what they did and how they did it.
Everyone has different reasons for building. One of the big things for me was affordability. I'm just not willing to pay for an already built aircraft (ability also figures in!), and since I was going to build an airplane it might as well be a representation of a WWI aircraft! The complete lack of skills didn't deter me, as the thread proves (whole lots of mistakes and "gooder enough" stuff in there).
Then again I'm flying for the pure pleasure of it - my "mission" is to look at cows, rivers, trees, and fields from 500-1,000 feet AGL on a pretty day. No more, no less. And I'm so jealous of this pleasure that I really don't want to bother with sharing it. If my mission was expanded even a jot I think I'd of gone for a PPL and a C150 or C172.
A friend of mine said there are two types of builders - pilots who make airplanes to fly, and airplane builders who are also pilots.* There's more than a grain of truth to it, and both sets have a lot to offer to the other. However, if the need is to fly right now with a minimum of fuss, buying a plane that's all put together is usually the way to go.
* There's a third category, aircraft restorers. I have the deepest respect for them, as repairing things to exacting specifications and ensuring everything is just so is a helluvalot harder than making something from scratch and modifying things as needed.
The opinions and statements of this poster are largely based on facts and portray a possible version of the actual events.
Great feedback, Ron. I'm a pretty analytical person, so believe me, I've played the scenarios in my head a few million times as well as worked the numbers. You are right, I could buy a Mooney right now for roughly the same amount or less that I will spend on the RV-10. The big things that keep bringing me back to the RV is its efficiency and short field landing capability. My wife and I plan to spend a time in the Bahamas when the kids are gone off to college (2 more years to get the last one out), so unknown runway lengths become a factor. Also, I think the people on this forum have infected me with the experimental aircraft bug. I like the freedom and flexibility of the experimental aircraft as well as the friendliness, camaraderie, willingness to help each other, and sense of community that is exemplified in this forum. I think I'm hooked!
Now to let you know "the rest of the story" ... I was first "hooked" at Oshkosh '76 and Paul's "Can Do" attitude. My first job, a "few" years later, was at EAA (autofuel STCs) and in Paul Poberezny's garage/workshop making the drawings for the Pober "Junior Ace" and "Super Ace." Over the course of my career, so far, I have been blessed with many first flights, which each and every one is an incredible event. I have also worked for and with some very incredible people and teams. I am currently the chief engineer at Mooney International-Chino. I am very proud of what our family here has done on the all-new M10. Look forward to great things to come ...
A well flown Mooney M 20 J, 201 can land on fairly short runways, 1800 feet or so, just come in at the right speed, about 70 and then power off and flare.
If you come in at 90 you need the same 1800 or so to land, plus another 1800 that you are going to float past while waiting to slow down.
You can buy a decent 201 or early Bonanza for perhaps $75,000.
But they are not going to be the station wagon that a Cherokee 6 is. They will be faster and more nimble.
For many people, building is one thing, flying is another. Do you really want to and have the time and discipline to spend 3 years or more building one?
A cheap, simple build airplane is not going to be all around better than a 201 or Bo. And you can build something fast and sleek and even acro capable, but it is not going to be cheap or quick and may be more demanding to fly with high wing loading, and sensitive pitch controls and fast landing speed, Ie Lancair, etc.
Maybe you should buy a 201 or other airplane to fly and if you really want to, use your spare time to build something. You can read or talk to people and most of all go and beg/buy some demo flights in a few that you are interested in.
One way or the other, welcome and go fly and fly safely.
I have a lot of experience with Kerrvile, Mooneys , I don't know anything about Chinese ones, except I sure would not want my plane to smell like a stinking diesel like the garbage truck.
Last edited by Bill Greenwood; 01-29-2015 at 11:25 AM.
The RV 10 is a great airplane that will outperform a Mooney 201 in every aspect. Van's kits and instructions are excellent and if you have any mechanical ability at all you can build one. Once you have it done you will know everything about the airplane and systems and will be able to do any repairs and inspections. With a quick build kit and some dedication you should be able to build one in 2 years. It requires a lifestyle change but we all watch too much TV anyway. I did my RV7 quickbuild in 14 months and I worked full time at my regular job and around 25hrs a week on the RV. I have flown 2 RV 10s and they are very docile and a roomy rock solid cruiser. I also have around 100 hrs in a Mooney 201 and it is good at going cross country with a decent load fairley fast on 10-12 gal hr. It flys like a truck and is no fun at all to just go yanking and banking. Out of all the types I've flown it is probably my least favorite airplane. Don
I have over a 1000 hours in 2 Mooneys and I have never heard anyone else say they "fly like a trucK" . As for as yanking and banking, a 201 is a normal gen av airplane, and good for going places. It it not an acro plane. Do you do acro in the RV-10? Vans website says "it is not an acrobatic airplane", but maybe you just ignore that. The 201. burns a whole lot less than 12 gal an hour, as a matter of fact it burns about 9 gal an hour leaned out at 7500 feet in cruise and that is at about 150 to 155 knots true. I flew mine to OSH and over 2/3 of the U S.
If you can build an airplane it 14 months you would be a lot faster than most, I think, and I really doubt if a beginner can do it anywhere nearly that quick.
Last edited by Bill Greenwood; 01-29-2015 at 01:06 PM.
Don, did we talk at Sanford, NC one day a few months back in the Wings clubhouse? I met someone who built an RV-7 they kept in a hangar at TTA. I know there'a couple down there.
I'm partial toward the cost of the Airdrome planes, but I think if the money wasn't an issue, I'd probably lean toward a RV-7a. It's hard to compare 20k over 2-3 years against 60k+ in a shorter time. Maybe as a second plane?
It appears that I'm the only RV-10 builder in this conversation, so my opinions will be biased.
i would be more than happy to answer any specific questions about the Rv-10, build process, or ongoing maintenance and performance. For those considering the rv-10, I can probably direct you to where a local rv-10 may be located. It's a small community and we get to know many of the builders over the years.
drop me an email. I don't get on here as often as I used to. It's blocked from my work pc.
What I like about this particular forum is that nobody is cutting down the other airplanes. It is a pet peeve of mine that people talk down about Experimentals and others talk down about spam cans, but in reality, they are different products (and typically with a different mission/purpose) ... and definitely with different owners in a different market. The bottom line is that we need each other; we are not making enough airplanes today, and flying has a bad reputation of being unsafe and only those that are daredevils fly.
Ironically, the prototype spam cans play by EXACTLY the same rules as homebuilts ... and I would like to say that we at Mooney (Chino) right now are having a riot playing in this area with the all-new M10 (sorry, I had to get a plug in there), but we are truly having a lot of fun at work. In fact, with my job, I don't know how I can call it "work" or a "job" ... and they pay me too!!! :o)
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