Ok...so the FAA wants everybody to install ADS-B. One of the best features of ADS-B is seeing other traffic. Probably one of the busiest pieces of airspace is around Oshkosh during Airventure, but the NOTAM directs everyone to turn off their transponder in the vicinity of OSH.
But ADS-B doesn't work if Transponders are off!
Shouldn't the OSH NOTAM be changed to leave transponders ON so that we have additional help seeing and avoiding each other?
Hush, TedK. Nobody wants to hear about the Emporer's nekkidness.Originally Posted by TedK
The technical problem is that the transponders step on each other and the ATC equipment can't do anything with what it sees.
When I fly formation, lead always squawks and everyone else puts their transponder on standby. If everyone squawks, the return codes all merge into what the ATC equipment translates as 1200 instead of the assigned code for lead.
So the NOTAM needs to say all transponders off.
Hope this helps,
Wes
N78PS
But if OSH is doing VFR arrivals, why do we care if the transponders are saturating the radar?
Last edited by TedK; 01-17-2015 at 08:03 PM.
If OSH is doing visual contact arrivals, why saturate the ATC system? Another consideration is that IFR arrivals are going on simultaneously with VFR arrivals (e.g., VFR on 36, IFR on 27.) IFR arrivals squawk.
MODE S is supposed to fix the "stepping on problem."
Frankly, I don't even think MODE C is that big of an issue these days. Oshkosh hasn't quite been that busy on arrivals as it was back in the heydey.
Well, for the next 5 years not everyone will have mode S and there is some likelihood that the OSH arrival will be filled with non-mode S for some time well beyond 2020.
And as a techie, I am skeptical to technical solutions to people problems. I will hazard a guess that ATC will still ask for formation flights to have only lead squawk. Lead is responsible for all of the ships and ATC will happily push off that responsibility onto flight lead since he/she owns separation between flight elements and ATC has nothing useful to say about it.
And looking at OSH, the price of avgas is plunging just like the price of auto gas. So perhaps we will see more ships arriving at Ripon for the next couple of seasons.
Best of luck,
Wes
N78PS
Well part of it is the decline in attendees, but the other part of it is that with the tinkering with the start dates (remember it used to start on Friday) it is now the case that everybody doesn't tend to arrive the day before the show starts anymore. We have a less frenetic pace all through the week.
It seems to me that OSH would seem to be a place where ADS-B could really be a benefit, particularly on the merge approaching Ripon, yet the NOTAM requests that everyone strangle their parrot.
it kinda strikes me like requiring everyone to turn out their lights so we don't dazzle those few with Night Vision Goggles.
If FAA wants everyone to have ADS-B, then the system should be set up to benefit those with it.
OK, perhaps I am dense, but I do not understand the benefit of ADS-B at Ripon. The controllers know that they will have a stream of traffic, they know that they can not provide advisories to each pilot due to the limited bandwidth of the voice radio, and the pilots know that any traffic display in their panel is going to go nuts as they approach Ripon. The approaching aircraft need to see and avoid by looking out the windshield. The controllers at Fisk really just coach people to stay in line and are not capable of doing much more. The dirty secret at ATC is that despite ADS-B reporting with GPS accuracy, the controller displays still have mile resolution.
And I have flown 2 NORDO arrivals into OSH. No comm, no transponder. After 2020 they should rename that the "stealth" or "phantom" arrival as those guys will be invisible to the NextGen system.
Am I missing something?
Wes
N78PS
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