SPORT AVIATION Mistake

[Bob Meder]

This is what I tell my students, from beginner through multi-engine instructor: it is not a propellor - it is an xx HP Cuisenart (xx depending on the engine, of course). Do not reach through the prop arc, regardless of how the engine was shut down, unless you have a really good reason (and even then, try to think of another way to do it). Never curl your fingers over the prop. Always be in a position to get away from it if something happens.

I can go on, but you get the idea. My "other" career is in an industry that has equipment that can kill you without even missing a beat. I've learned from what we teach about safety is that the second you become complacent in anyway, you're a statistic that hasn't been written down yet.

[Bob Dingley]

Thankfully they came through the picture posing without a scratch.


I recall a friend. We were military pilots serving together and we both were members of the flying club. The club CE 177RG was a favorite of Dave's and his family. One day Dave and a few friends were in the hangar looking at the 177 when someone, don't know who, lightly touched the prop. Only one cylinder fired but Dave was in the prop arc. He was hit on the head and all reports were that he wouldn't make it. He had been promoted to Major three months before.


Fast forward a year and half. My wife and I were at the Mall and someone tapped me on the back. It was Dave and his wife. He knew me but couldnt remember my name. He recalled that I flew the jump ship for the sport parachute club but he couldn't remember the name of that thing that he wore on his back when he jumped.


He was retired of course. I ran into Dave at reunions He was getting stronger every year and he was making a comeback. His recovery was looking much like Max Conrad's, the pilot that set all the records fying for Piper. Max had a prop hit him in the head way back before WW2 and he later logged 50.000 hours.


I have been following a thread on the Homebuilders Forum by JIMDC8. He is building his Twin Jag. Instead of feathering props, he is using a brake on each prop. Just wondering.


Bob

[1600vw]

Thankfully they came through the picture posing without a scratch.


I recall a friend. We were military pilots serving together and we both were members of the flying club. The club CE 177RG was a favorite of Dave's and his family. One day Dave and a few friends were in the hangar looking at the 177 when someone, don't know who, lightly touched the prop. Only one cylinder fired but Dave was in the prop arc. He was hit on the head and all reports were that he wouldn't make it. He had been promoted to Major three months before.


Fast forward a year and half. My wife and I were at the Mall and someone tapped me on the back. It was Dave and his wife. He knew me but couldnt remember my name. He recalled that I flew the jump ship for the sport parachute club but he couldn't remember the name of that thing that he wore on his back when he jumped.


He was retired of course. I ran into Dave at reunions He was getting stronger every year and he was making a comeback. His recovery was looking much like Max Conrad's, the pilot that set all the records fying for Piper. Max had a prop hit him in the head way back before WW2 and he later logged 50.000 hours.


I have been following a thread on the Homebuilders Forum by JIMDC8. He is building his Twin Jag. Instead of feathering props, he is using a brake on each prop. Just wondering.


Bob

Why I say kill your engine by starving it for fuel. This would have never happened had the pilot done this. This story makes a good point for this. Would you leave a bullet in the camber. you are doing this when you leave a fuel air mixture in the cylinder ready to fire. It's a loaded gun.

Tony

[Floatsflyer]

Bill, is it OK if I clean the bugs off the nose of my airplane? Or do I have to wait until the prop is removed to do that?

It's a no brainier: stay out of the prop arc and don't lean on the prop unless necessary like cleaning the bugs off the nose but much more commonly like....when doing the walk-around to remove intake covers, checking the prop edges for nicks(and filing as necessary) and checking full operation of an oleo strut.

Nothing is ever absolute so we must always be vigilant and use our common sense.

[jam0552@msn.com]

As long as we are telling propeller stories - I have one that should cause every mechanic to treat them as Bill suggests in first post. I was installing overhauled mags on a C150. I had the propeller in the middle of a compression stroke and bent down underneath the descending blade to reach a nut om the mag. I accidentally bumped the propeller and it finished its stroke. The compression pushed it down suddenly and it's razor sharp leading edge struck me on my forehead just below my hairline. I bled profusely for about 15 min. Luckily it was able to hold the cut together with a butterfly bandage, no stitches required. I now have a 4" scar on my forehead to remind me of the inherent dangers of a propeller. Stay clear of it, no exceptions...
-Joel Marketello

[1600vw]

It's a no brainier: stay out of the prop arc and don't lean on the prop unless necessary like cleaning the bugs off the nose but much more commonly like....when doing the walk-around to remove intake covers, checking the prop edges for nicks(and filing as necessary) and checking full operation of an oleo strut.

Nothing is ever absolute so we must always be vigilant and use our common sense.

I agree. But we remove the bullets from not only the gun but the chamber for a reason. Why in the world would you leave a cylinder ready to fire. All these examples you speak of was just that. A person leaving a bullet in the chamber and then letting others handle said gun. You are asking for trouble as we all know and this is why if you are not using this gun you disarm it chamber and all.

One should treat an engine like a gun. Never leave it laying around with a bullet in the chamber ready to fire expecting the ignition switch as the only means of a safety. That ignition switch is no safety never rely on it.

My engine will never bite you when setting in my hangar. I have disarmed it. You can play with it all you want, it will not go off. NEVER........

Tony

[Floatsflyer]

Tony, Tony, Tony, I appreciate your ongoing, knock us over the head metaphor but I and thousands of other pilots will continue to do proper and complete walk-a-rounds involving close proximity to the prop because it is the necessary, vital and responsible thing to do and should always be if you take yourself seriously as a pilot.

As the cop used to say on "Hill Street Blues", "Let's be careful out there."

[1600vw]

Tony, Tony, Tony, I appreciate your ongoing, knock us over the head metaphor but I and thousands of other pilots will continue to do proper and complete walk-a-rounds involving close proximity to the prop because it is the necessary, vital and responsible thing to do and should always be if you take yourself seriously as a pilot.

As the cop used to say on "Hill Street Blues", "Let's be careful out there."

Just like a gun I respect it even when its empty. Same with a prop. But do you leave a loaded gun laying around? Why would you leave a loaded engine laying around? All the stories are of just that. A loaded engine was left sitting or a loaded gun was left sitting, it will kill you just as a gun.

Yep you are right I am all wet on this and should stop telling others how to leave an engine setting. I just hope those I tell to never leave a loaded gun laying around do not have the same attitude as the folks on this board.

A loaded gun laying around the house is ok as long as you do not handle it. Sounds like a stupid statement to me too.

Sure you should not get into the arc of the prop. But just because you are not to do this, does not give you the go ahead to leave said engine loaded. Unload it then respect it. But do not leave it loaded and say stay away. We all know thousands have been killed using this attitude with guns.

Tony

[1600vw]

Just like a gun I respect it even when its empty. Same with a prop. But do you leave a loaded gun laying around? Why would you leave a loaded engine laying around? All the stories are of just that. A loaded engine was left sitting or a loaded gun was left sitting, it will kill you just as a gun.

Yep you are right I am all wet on this and should stop telling others how to leave an engine setting. I just hope those I tell to never leave a loaded gun laying around do not have the same attitude as the folks on this board.

A loaded gun laying around the house is ok as long as you do not handle it. Sounds like a stupid statement to me too.

Sure you should not get into the arc of the prop. But just because you are not to do this, does not give you the go ahead to leave said engine loaded. Unload it then respect it. But do not leave it loaded and say stay away. We all know thousands have been killed using this attitude with guns.

Tony

My point as to this post. People handle unloaded guns and put pics of it in magazines all the time. No one says a word about safety. But lean on a prop, put a pic in a magazine and now someone stepped over the line. If that engine was shut down properly there would not be an issue with handling the prop or leaning on it.

I take it everyone on this board would freak when they see me after my flight turning my prop by hand when I am cleaning all the bug juice off it. But my engine just died from lack of fuel. There is no way that engine is starting not without going through atleast 3 complete revolutions with the choke out and the mixture control moved to the rich setting and the mag switch turned on.

Anything else and you can turn that prop all day and it will not start. I know I tried.

Tony

P.S. Doing things this way I will never get caught with my fuel off. The engine will never start until I turn the fuel on.

[lnuss]

If I just had said gun in my hands, took all ammo from it and broke it down if it was a shot gun you bet. Point that gun at me all you want.

Don't point that thing at me! And you'd not be welcome on my range with that attitude. The NRA's three safety rules are:

1. ALWAYS keep the gun pointed in a safe direction.
2. ALWAYS keep your finger off the trigger until ready to shoot.
3. ALWAYS keep the gun unloaded until ready to use.

I bring this up because it's also a good attitude with that meat cleaver on an aircraft. Any one of them can keep you safe IF there are NO mistakes made by imperfect humans, but we all make mistakes at one time or another, no matter how hard we try, since we are not perfect. But if you follow #1, a mistake with #2 or #3 can't hurt you. You actually have three practices that almost completely eliminate the chance of a serious mistake. But they ALL take practice, especially the first one. For some things it might not matter, but with the potential consequences of a mistake in this area the belt and suspenders approach can be a life saver.

The same is true of avoiding the prop arc. Sure, there are certain situations where you might not be able to avoid that prop arc, but they should be rare, and faithfully practicing that avoidance should (hopefully) come to make you uncomfortable getting into that arc. This is NOT saying that the other practices shouldn't be followed, just that staying out of that arc is akin to rule #1 above.