Licenses vs. Certificates, Aviators vs. Pilots, This vs. That

[Mike M]

But to a lot of people that difference doesn't matter.

So true. To many, the difference between a basic human right and a government-granted license doesn't matter. Think, Second Amendment argument. Or abortion-on-demand. Or homosexual marriage. Wait a minute. Maybe people do care about the difference, once they know there IS a difference.

[Mayhemxpc]

PPL is an ICAO/JAA term. When I first heard aviators (aviators or airmen -- or are they air-people now?) in Europe -- England too -- refer to PPL I had no idea what they were talking about. (If you think Americans love acronyms, try dealing with Germans.) After awhile I figured it out without having to 'fess up to my ignorance. ICAO and the JAA use the term "license" and letter codes to describe the ratings (PPL, CPL, MPL, ATPL). Is this usage something slipping over from Canada?

[Bob Dingley]

PPL is an ICAO/JAA term. When I first heard aviators (aviators or airmen -- or are they air-people now?) in Europe -- England too -- refer to PPL I had no idea what they were talking about. (If you think Americans love acronyms, try dealing with Germans.) After awhile I figured it out without having to 'fess up to my ignorance. ICAO and the JAA use the term "license" and letter codes to describe the ratings (PPL, CPL, MPL, ATPL). Is this usage something slipping over from Canada?

I'll "fess up" too. I had no idea. I recall that it took half a decade to master terms when A&E became A&P and ATR went to ATP.

And what is the difference between AVIATOR and PILOT?

[Gil]

And what is the difference between AVIATOR and PILOT?

I think there are many, many aviators who aren't pilots.

[Bill Greenwood]

As if it really mattered , I have often read or heard many famous aviation people like Martha and John King refer to a PPL as "a license to learn". I've never heard anyone say "certificate to learn".

[Mayhemxpc]

"And what is the difference between AVIATOR and PILOT?"

It seems that the Army and the Navy have Aviators, the USAF has Pilots and the FAA certifies Airmen. In case you think it is a distinction without a difference, here are the thoughts of one pilot/aviator/airman on the subject:

There are airmen and there are pilots: the first being part bird whose view from aloft is normal and comfortable, a creature whose brain and muscles frequently originate movements which suggest flight; and then there are pilots who regardless of their airborne time remain earth-loving bipeds forever. When these latter unfortunates, because of one urge or another, actually make an ascension, they neither anticipate nor relish the event and they drive their machines with the same graceless labor they inflict upon the family vehicle.

-- Ernest K. Gann

That, and both the Navy and the Army have boats, ships, and other floating craft which are also piloted.

[TedK]

"And what is the difference between AVIATOR and PILOT?"

IM<HO Pilots are manipulators of the controls, and are a subset of the family of aviators which includes pilots, navigators, aircrew, etc, and most importantly, those who have not yet broken the surly bonds as aircrew but possess that special attitude and worldview that make them aviators.

Airventure is a wonderful case in point, there are many pilots there, but there are more aviators.

i think the definition has evolved some since it's earliest usage.

[Mike M]

"And what is the difference between AVIATOR and PILOT?"...both the Navy and the Army have boats, ships, and other floating craft which are also piloted.

I don't know for sure what the Army calls their aircraft operators. In Naval Aviator training we were taught that PILOT was an honored job description for highly skilled professional seamen for hundreds of years before aircraft were invented. We are NOT to insult them by usurping their title!

[Mayhemxpc]

Hal,

I think that the thread has strayed from its original topic, which was logging flight time. What we call people who slip the surly bonds and fling their eager craft through footless halls of air seems to be a fun topic, but it is off topic for this thread. Suggestions?

Chris
N424AF

[Hal Bryan]

Hal,

I think that the thread has strayed from its original topic, which was logging flight time. What we call people who slip the surly bonds and fling their eager craft through footless halls of air seems to be a fun topic, but it is off topic for this thread. Suggestions?

Chris
N424AF

Chris - agreed. It's been split...and trimmed a little.