New FAA Ruling ?

[Bill Greenwood]

Frank, your point is only on cell phones. Obviously no one in their right mind wants to hear a bunch of cell phone talk in an airplane. But that is not the way the ban is now. The FAA and the airlines claim that one has to turn off ALL electronic gadgets, ("anything with an on/off switch") and they use the safety boogey man to justify this. So it applies to computers, Ipads , Game boys, etc. Can't even listen to music in flight with ear phones when below 10,000.
And I agree that most cell phone talk is because someone is bored and/or nervous. I don't own a cell phone, but I carry a borrowed one when I travel. I don't leave it on and don't even know how to do the message part. I am pretty old fashioned I guess, because it never occured to me to try to spend time at EAA on my cell phone and then gripe becasue the wi fi reception wasn't as good as in N Y or L A.
I used to fly a lot over most of the U S with my kids in the back seat usually avidly playing their game boys, and I never had any spurious fuel warning lights or instrument or avionics signals.
Have you ever noticed that a lot of people, at least men cannot sit or stand still when they talk? If they are talking on their cell phone they are pacing around. I went to a maintenance forum at EAA and it was good but almost hypnotic as the presenter paced back in forth on the stage.

Anyway, as I read the announcement if the ban is lifted/modified it won't include cell phone talk. The next step for airlines who are always trying to find new revenue will probably be some hookup so that, FOR A FEE, you can make or send cell phone calls in flight, probably have to use an earphone.

[CDS]

Frank, your point is only on cell phones.

Bill,

My concern is mainly cell phones, but also anything else that transmits; I saw a boy try to use a radio control car in the aisle not too long ago. If you'll reread the last paragraph in my earlier post (reply #35), you'll see that I'd support a partial lifting of the ban now.

Also, you're probably correct in that airlines would find a way to impose a fee for phone use. They're earning billions in bag fees already.

Blue skies,
CDS

[Flyfalcons]

The research seems to point to new airliners being very cell phone resistant, which is a very good thing.

I do wonder sometimes about the difference between an undamaged ones (which are used in testing) versus some of the "amazing it still works" models I see people using with broken screens and tape holding them together.

Personally I'd like to see the ban remain in place so that I don't have to hear inane conversations while trapped in the metal tube.

"Yeah, we just landed and are pulling up towards the gate. Is Marge at the house? Her boyfriend [terrible relationship details best left to the Springer show] was in the hospital for [heinous medical condition] where they [horrible procedures]."

I never understood the sense of urgency with making calls while on a flight. If one is to be met, either they're already there waiting (and therefore not need to be told one has arrived as it's announced on information boards throughout the airport) or they aren't, in which case one would find out the minute they got to baggage claim. When I was flying on business, a call when I had obtained the rental car to confirm agendas was more on point as that was when I was in a position to act on any changes.

I'm convinced, however, that 90% or more of cell phone conversations is because the caller is bored and wants to be entertained in some way by another. This is why I rarely carry a cell phone and keep conversations very brief - it is not my job to be imposed on for the sake of keeping someone from being bored.

If it makes you feel any better, when I was on the CRJ I got to hear the smart phones being updated through the comm radios. Got the telltale "Dah dat dat Dah dat dat Dah" phone update sounds right in my headset.

[rwanttaja]

Bill,

My concern is mainly cell phones, but also anything else that transmits; I saw a boy try to use a radio control car in the aisle not too long ago.

In the brat's defense, many "radio control" tools actually use IR links, which should have an even lower possibility of causing problems.

Of course, I wouldn't want to put the crew in the position of having to decide that Johnny can use his toy, but Timmy can't....

This is the problem they'll have if they *do* permit *some* devices, or devices even in "airplane" mode. The crew has to turn into technology experts to be the arbiter of what can and what cannot be used. More and more people seem to retain that five-year-old's sense of outraged entitlement. "I paid for this, you can't tell me I can't use it here! You can't, you can't you can't!" The crew having to make these kinds of decisions is going to lead to some P.O.d customers.

If cell phone transmissions are the remaining issue, the airlines should install strong cell-phone jammers on their airplanes. That gives known signal levels and types to certify the avionics against; the phones won't produce a stronger signal that the jammer.

Ron Wanttaja

[Jim Hann]

If cell phone transmissions are the remaining issue, the airlines should install strong cell-phone jammers on their airplanes. That gives known signal levels and types to certify the avionics against; the phones won't produce a stronger signal that the jammer.

Ron Wanttaja

Ron, I think you are on to something. Since new composite airliners usually need mesh embedded in the structure lets just make the entire cabin into a faraday cage! (I might have spelled that wrong.)

CDS, thanks for the info on the classic Guppy. I'm with you, I support a partial lifting of the ban but transmitters still scare me. I don't fly pax anymore so unfortunately it's the piles of Li batteries that I need to worry about now. I've already lost two coworkers and the company has lost two airframes to these batteries.

Fly safe!

[Bill Greenwood]

The NBC news site has the story on it today, Tue. Oct. 1. dated 9-27.
The example given is Delta who had 2 million passenger flights and had 27 reports of "POSSIBLE" interference from an electronic device.
"NONE OF THE REPORTED INSTANCES COULD BE VERIFIED."

The real danger for an airline is not some passenger on a cell phone or I pad; rather it is financial. Delta , like others has already had one bankruptcy. I had some bonds issued to pay for their terminal at DFW which they defaulted on.

[Greg Bockelman]

The NBC news site has the story on it today, Tue. Oct. 1. dated 9-27.
The example given is Delta who had 2 million passenger flights and had 27 reports of "POSSIBLE" interference from an electronic device.
"NONE OF THE REPORTED INSTANCES COULD BE VERIFIED."

The real danger for an airline is not some passenger on a cell phone or I pad; rather it is financial. Delta , like others has already had one bankruptcy. I had some bonds issued to pay for their terminal at DFW which they defaulted on.

Isn't the fact that it might be possible worthy of some consideration?

[Bill Greenwood]

Greg, maybe we should all stay out of the woods, never go hiking or hunting or visiting places like Yellowstone. After all isn't there a possibility that some of these reports about Bigfoot might be true?
And of course, it is best to stay in the house at night, after all with at least 27 reports of aliens kidnapping people and taking them on board their spaceships!

Now there are a few spoil sports that might point out that there are ZERO NTSB reports of crashes due to cell phones or ipads, just at there are ZERO autopsy reports that list the cause of death as Bigfoot or aliens; but this just shows that some folks just lack imagination and want to confuse a good tale with facts.

[Greg Bockelman]

Seems you are on a vendetta, Bill.

Having said that, I am sort of playing Devil's Advocate here.

But, I do think that there are enough unknowns that the risks can't just be ignored.

[rwanttaja]

Seems you are on a vendetta, Bill.

Having said that, I am sort of playing Devil's Advocate here.

But, I do think that there are enough unknowns that the risks can't just be ignored.

One must also balance the risks with the rewards. I've flown commercial quite a bit over the last several months, and it's no hardship to shut down the Kindle for a few minutes in each flight. Remember, this latest round of the controversy started because a celebrity didn't want to stop playing a game. Boo flippin' hoo.

Ron Wanttaja