Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 13

Thread: Writing about politics?

  1. #1

    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    2,575

    Writing about politics?

    on another topic someone complains that he may go somewhere else since some have written about gas prices and oil drilling and alternate energy including new car and plane propulsion and most of all, that bogey man called politics.

    What is "politics"?

    I think to some, those who complain the most, and who resort to bad manners, bad language or profanity, the definition of "politics" really means anything that they don't agree with. This is the broadest definition, so that complainer can cover any topic posted with his objection.

    If you look in the dictionary, the definition is obviously the topic of elections of candidates running for office and/or of laws proposed or passed. This is, without a doubt real politics, and there is very little of it on EAA, or most other aviation sites.
    Even then, there may be relevance, for instance some candidate may be a pilot or more friendly to gen av than others, ( I know the man who used to fly Bill Clinton around Ark to campaign for gov there, in a C-180.) Sen. Coburn is an active pilot and has a proposed law before the FAA, if I have the right person.

    But there is a secondary, less specific definition of politics, that of govt and it's actions.
    AND ANYONE WHO DOESN'T THINK GOVT IS RELATED TO AVIATION IS IN A VACUUM , AND THIS GOES FOR NOT JUST AIRLINES OR MILITARY BUT GEN AV ALSO. Look what Daley did to Meigs Field, and what they tried to do but were stopped at GWS, Co. and Clearwater, Fla.

    We as pilots, owners, or just fans of gen av and sport av, should and even must be concerned with govt as related to our profession, sport, or hobby.
    EAA joins with AOPA and others like CAF, etc, at times to do some very important lobbying and public relations type work. If not, our wheel would run pretty dry and someone else would have all the grease.

    I hope everyone is a member of not only EAA, but also AOPA and any other group that is helping keep us flying and doing a lot of the work that would be hard and less effective if we tried to do it as individuals.
    By the way, I see AOPA, the larger organization, as perhaps the main course, and EAA and other smaller, more specialized ones as sort or like the dessert, or spice, that makes a meal more than just something to fill up on.
    Last edited by Bill Greenwood; 01-02-2012 at 09:37 PM.

  2. #2
    Too preachy Bill, go flying, it's much more rewarding.

  3. #3
    Hangar10's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Owasso, Oklahoma
    Posts
    185
    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Greenwood View Post
    Sen. Coburn is an active pilot and has a proposed law before the FAA, if I have the right person.
    I think you are talking of the OTHER Oklahoma senator, Bill... EAA member and general aviation supporter, Jim Inhofe. You are right though, as with most sports or hobbies (shooting sports, amateur radio, aviation to name a few), the gub'ment plays a BIG role in how (or if) we are allowed to enjoy these activities.

  4. #4

    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    2,575
    Mark, I knew I was not sure of the name when I wrote it, that's why I put the question there.
    I sat in Sen. Inhofe's seminar at EAA Osh, but couldn't remember his name.
    Last edited by Bill Greenwood; 01-03-2012 at 01:48 PM.

  5. #5

    Yeah, he's a real saint....

    ...... back in April, Sen. James Inhofe of Oklahoma , a long-time pilot and advocate for aviation, had two unusual aviation experiences recently.

    The first was that he landed on a runway that was closed and under repair, "sky-hopping" over construction workers who were on the runway at the time. This move led the airport manager to say, in a phone call recorded by the FAA, "I've got over 50 years flying, three tours of Vietnam, and I can assure you I have never seen such a reckless disregard for human life in my life." Inhofe apparently begged to differ, steaming out of the plane on arrival and telling the airport staff, "What the hell is this? I was supposed to have unlimited airspace."

    The second was that the FAA decided that the appropriate sanction for Inhofe was "remedial training," mainly a discussion and check flight with an FAA inspector, rather than any of the "certificate actions" (suspension etc) that pilots dread and that typically follow "pilot deviations" of this sort. I don't wish enforcement actions on anyone, but the question is whether the "remediation" approach had anything to do with his status as a big shot.

    AMAZING, the only guy with enough pull to help us is essentially a...pilot with no respect for the rules of the game. Things are getting sadder every day.....
    Last edited by Hal Bryan; 01-04-2012 at 12:12 PM.

  6. #6

    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Dallas, Texas, United States
    Posts
    53
    Beat me to the punch

    Here is a quote from the Senator regarding NOTAMS:

    Sen. James Inhofe (R-Okla.) says he won't guarantee he'll be more vigilant about checking NOTAMs after he landed on a closed runway occupied by maintenance workers ten days ago in Texas. "People who fly a lot just don't do it," Inhofe told the Tulsa World. "I won't make any commitments." Inhofe added that while "technically" pilots should "probably" check NOTAMs, it would be impractical for him to do so on the many flights he makes to small airports in Oklahoma each year.
    A pilot that can't be bothered to check NOTAMS should have his ticket yanked.

  7. #7
    EAA Staff / Moderator Hal Bryan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Oshkosh, Wisconsin, United States
    Posts
    1,296
    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Greenwood View Post
    EAA joins with AOPA and others like CAF, etc, at times to do some very important lobbying and public relations type work... I hope everyone is a member of not only EAA, but also AOPA and any other group that is helping keep us flying and doing a lot of the work that would be hard and less effective if we tried to do it as individuals.
    Well put, Bill. This, to me, is the key point of this thread - when we actively discourage political discussions on a forum like this, it's not because we've got our heads buried in the sand and mean to pretend that aviation and politics happen in two separate vacuums. As Bill points out, we do a lot of advocacy, often side-by-side with AOPA and the other "alphabet groups", and it's a very real part of our day-to-day lives.

    What, as one poster put it, gives us (moderators) heartburn, are discussions that turn into unresolvable shouting matches - "TFRs are a conspiracy by those idiot Whigs!", "If you morons would just vote for the South Carolina Nullifiers, there'd be free AVGAS for everyone!"

    I have no problem with people calmly pointing out the aviation-related positions (and foibles) of public figures, but I think all of us can do a better job of communicating without overt name-calling. Just remember to keep it civil. I have no interest in deleting posts (other than spam, of course) and all that, but we will make an occasional tweak if things are headed off the rails.

    Hal Bryan
    EAA Lifetime 638979
    Vintage 714005 | Warbirds 553527
    Managing Editor
    EAA—The Spirit of Aviation

  8. #8

    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    2,575
    Guys, I went to hear the Inhofe speech at Osh, partly because Bob Hoover was there.
    First of all, I don't think we should be so "holier than thou" against another pilot. If you are a pilot and never made a mistake, then you probably are able to ascend to the heavens by levitation and don't need a plane. For the rest of us mortals, we try to do it right, but I don't know any quarterback that never threw an interception. I don't think we need personal insults against anyone, let's just debate what the do.
    I find it strange that I am somewhat defending Inhofe, as he is an oil industry spokesman, and freely calls himself the most conservative senator, while I am not in the oil business directly although I have some investments there, and I am more of a liberal.

    Back to what Inhofe said at the seminar: if I have it correct, he may have said that the notam was not properly published or distributed. I don't know the gist or truth of this. He said either that he didn't see the closed runway signs or at the last moment thought it was too late to go around safely. I think he said he landed past the workmen so did not endanger them. I am giving his side as I recall it.

    Anyway, here is what I think happened. He often flys to that very airport at the Texas coast, and so was complacent. MOST OF ALL, I think like a lot of people, he often flys on an IFR flight plan, as I think he was doing then in his light twin, and he does this regardless of the weather. I think he got into the frame of mind that despite it being VFR, that it was the duty of ATC to look out for him, and that ATC should have known and alerted him to the notam and runway closure. I very rarely fly on an IFR plan, almost never in IMC, and as I know it the job of ATC is to provide separation between other planes on IFR plans. If they can, they may also give advice or alerts on weather. I do use VFR flight plans on most every trip, especially over the mountains or in hostile terrain.

    A pilot is supposed to get the weather info, AND NOTAMS, before flight, and the way it has been done in the past was to phone or walk into flight service. Believe it or not, in the good old days there actually were real flight service stations with real live human beings and even windows that you could look out of at many airports like Gjc, Co. and Ft, Dodge, Iowa. Now a lot of them or closed. I think the next step down will be you call FSS and get some guy in Indonesia, or just a recording that tells you to go online.
    So anyway, nowadays so many people are in a big hurry, and they don't call FSS and get a full briefing. If your fellow pilot has some cool gadget like a cell phone or I pad or some such, then you may not want to be outnerded and just make a plain old 1-800 phone call to get the weather. Man, that is is the pilot equivalent of not having granite countertops in your kitchen!
    So pilots get in a hurry, they rely on some gadget and take shortcuts and don't get a full briefing and may miss a notam or even a TFR. What till the pres and cong campaigns get in full swing this summer and fall, and there will be lots of last minute TFRs poping up with travel. When Cheney was vp he often used to go to Vail, and there would be a TFR at theEagle airport about 20 miles from me.
    Last edited by Bill Greenwood; 01-04-2012 at 12:36 PM.

  9. #9

    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Dallas, Texas, United States
    Posts
    53
    Bill, I had no issue with the specific incident, if it was a one-off. As you said, we all make mistakes and I believe the vast majority of us try learn from them.I do have an issue with a pilot that says checking the NOTAMS is impractical to do since he flies a lot.

  10. #10
    Those of you trying to 'see it from his view' seems to be ignoring the comments of EVRYONE else witness to the situation. What kind of ....pilot (for you Hal) would line up on a runway with workers and equipment on it and then finally notice the problem while in the flare? Come on guys - this was a grievous offense and not worth the hand-wringing excuses you are coming up with. He should be removed from the pilot roles for a good time to think about his poor habits and the danger he represents to the public and other aviators.

    Unfortunately, as I said, we have only him to beat the drum for less storm trooper tactics from the FAA and that's what I meant by sad. If this is just all too real and to the point for you Hal, delete it and my membership. When you guys quit playing politics with important issues like this maybe something will finally improve. Your method hasn't worked so far.

    It's just like saying I don't like PACs but this one is mine so it's OK......
    Last edited by flyingriki; 01-04-2012 at 01:06 PM.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •