Graduates of the Moulton Taylor School of Aeronautical Engineering((at MIT)

[Floatsflyer]

Just gotta love those Terrafugia guys. They haven't delivered a single production version of their long in development Transition flying car as yet but they took the time to put out a press release yesterday for a newly conceived design of a 4 place, plug-in, hybrid, electric VTOL flying car. The picture is very cool and Star Wars-like.

CEO Carl Dietrich said, "This is the right time for us to begin thinking about the future of the company beyond Transition development. We are passionate about continuing to lead the creation of a flying-car industry..."

Carl, IMHO, you, your team and your investors have to give your collective heads a shake. "...thinking about the future beyond Transition..." How can you think about the FUTURE when there has not been a PRESENT??!! "...lead the creation of a flying-car industry..." WHAT INDUSTRY??!!

I appreciate and applaud your visionary qualities and your innovational mindset. It's exactly what GA needs but you have drunk too much of the cool-aid. Your smarts and talents would better serve GA in some other productive capacity. I'm afraid I must defer to the words of Lou Grant when he said to Mary Richards, "You've got spunk....I hate spunk."

[skier]

Personally, I'm starting to see Terrafugia as the next Moller Skycar.

[Bill Berson]

I think EAA should not allow the sale of production order deposits at Oshkosh for any of these new designs until the 40 hours test period is complete.
I know EAA Sport Aviation magazine has (or had) a plans for sale policy with similar requirements.


This business model of selling deposits before the testing is done often results in problems when the aircraft can't meet specs. There is a strong temptation to get the product sold, sometimes with major safety problems.

This latest outlandish VTOL announcement from Terrafugia makes me wonder if they ever had any actual intent to sell a real product at all.

[MEdwards]

Sorry, but I think the title of this thread does a bit of disservice to old Molt Taylor. His Aerocar was real, it DID fly, and he received several honors including induction into the EAA Hall of Fame.

[steveinindy]

Just gotta love those Terrafugia guys. They haven't delivered a single production version of their long in development Transition flying car as yet but they took the time to put out a press release yesterday for a newly conceived design of a 4 place, plug-in, hybrid, electric VTOL flying car. The picture is very cool and Star Wars-like.

Why should we encourage them to spend time on flashy Photoshop marketing rather than actually producing a practical model of their proposed product? Personally, I don't "love those Terrafugia guys". What they are doing is a huge waste of some very expensive engineering education and it appears that they could have gone to a third rate school and come out with exactly the same business model and the same god-awfully Quasimodo-esque project that doesn't appear to be either a good car or a good airplane. I do have to laud them for apparently finding someone to give them a masters class in bilking people out of research and development funding. Then again, it isn't hard to get people in the aviation community jazzed up by tossing the words "flying car" into your proposal. You say that and people start seeing the sky full of these contraptions without consideration for the operational, training or support infrastructure necessary. It might "revitalize GA" but it also might make your local airport have congestion that makes O'Hare during peak times look like a lazy Sunday drive in the country or finally produce sufficiently high enough body counts to give the enemies of GA the impetus and ammo they need to shut us down once and for all.

Personally, I'm starting to see Terrafugia as the next Moller Skycar.

Yup...it's a gigantic Ponzi scheme albeit one organized by some very well educated folks who have learned to prey upon the adolescent desires of a lot of men to own a "flying car".

This business model of selling deposits before the testing is done often results in problems when the aircraft can't meet specs.

It just makes me think of the Ford Pinto with the Cessna 337 wings and tail welded on (well....sort of welded on).

I think EAA should not allow the sale of production order deposits at Oshkosh for any of these new designs until the 40 hours test period is complete.

Personally, I wouldn't want anything to do with the sales of them before the pass a full FAA certification and flight test (with no exceptions; either it passes the standard or it does not...none of this weaseling out of spin recovery, etc) AND until after I see how one of them holds up to an Insurance Institute for Highway Safety crash test or two. My money is on that it would be fare somewhere between "Cirrus versus tree at Chapel Hill" (if you haven't seen the picture of it from the NTSB, send me a message and I'll e-mail it to you; it's probably too graphic on the seats and wing to just post it here) and "SmartCar versus 18-wheeler".

[steveinindy]

Sorry, but I think the title of this thread does a bit of disservice to old Molt Taylor.

Molt was a heck of an engineer. A little too pie in the sky or Quixotic in some of his professional pursuits, but he definitely was a bright guy and I would be happy if some day I am 1/100th of the designer he was on his not-so-great days. I agree that it's an insult to compare this abortive MIT monstrosity to the Aerocar which while it was a complete failure in the practical sense, it was a failure due to things other than it being a poor design which is what has been overlooked and caused all subsequent designers to meet a similar fate. What's that saying about those who fail to learn the lessons of the past?

His Aerocar was real, it DID fly, and he received several honors including induction into the EAA Hall of Fame.

Technically, the original Terror-fugly-ia has flown too. Not very well in my book, but it got off the ground.

[SBaircraft]

I agree that it was foolish to aggressively market such ambitious plans, after so many delays with the Transition. I’m not sure what they were thinking. That said, they aren’t the only aircraft designers to recently discuss autonomous VTOL. Pipistrel recently shared a conceptual design for a single-place, electric VTOL. Pipistrel has the credibility that Terrafugia lacks.

As an aerospace engineer, I used to work with unmanned air vehicles, including one VTOL project. On a small scale, autonomous VTOL has improved by leaps and bounds in recent years. Electric quadcopters can catch, throw, and balance objects. They can dance to music, play instruments, move blocks, assemble structures, and fly in formations. Just maybe… it is no longer crazy to consider flying a 170 pound payload, from a home, to an office.

In the meantime, I’m not holding my breath for a flying car anytime soon. I get around just fine, with much simpler solutions.

[Floatsflyer]

Sorry, but I think the title of this thread does a bit of disservice to old Molt Taylor. His Aerocar was real, it DID fly, and he received several honors including induction into the EAA Hall of Fame.

The thread title was never intended to be insulting or disrespectful to Taylor, rather the opposite is the case. It was meant in the vien of being desciples of and paying homage to Taylor. The various Transition prototypes have flown and been driven on roads for over 3 years. Terrafugia has solved many design problems and overcome certain challenges associated with the practicality and enginneering of flying cars that Taylor didn't or couldn't 60 years ago.

This new design announcement just greatly increases the already present sarcasm, skepticism, ridicule and credibility issues targeted at the company. And to add further flames to the fire, they are presently considering issuing an IPO. If that is successful the result will not endear future investors to GA.

[steveinindy]

Terrafugia has solved many design problems and overcome certain challenges associated with the practicality and enginneering of flying cars that Taylor didn't or couldn't 60 years ago.

Such as?

[Frank Giger]

Such as breaking the one million dollar barrier in blind investment funds.