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Thread: Parachute question (technicality)

  1. #21

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    Steve, maybe I am not the norm, but I sure don't take off my seat belt, EVER, while I am flying. And that includes when I am in a plane capable of acro , or just my Bonanza or an airliner unless I am going to the restroom. And I wear it all the time I am driving, not just on freeways or weekdays or any other bad reason.
    Sure, I may have not have it as tight as it will go all the time, and part of my landing checklist is to snug it up, but I don't unbuckle it. What purpose does that serve? I can't imagine wanting to fly along with a chute half on and half off.That would be like having fire insurance on your house that was only good for every other day.

    In Joe's case, he got out, even at low altitude, he did pull the ripcord, and the chute did open, but pulled off of him. I am not certain if it was the leg straps or the chest strap left undone, but that it what I was told. I don't think it is known what went wrong with his engine leading to the bailout. I can't write all I'd like to on a public site on this, but maybe we will meet at Osh or somewhere. The end result was as tragic as if he'd not had a chute at all, and probably could have been avoided.

    I have done a lot of T-34 flying. It is sort of on the edge of the spectrum of really needing a chute. It is as reliable as a simple Bonanza and if I had to do a forced emergency landing, it would be my first choice of plane. You may do acro, but aren't really likely to do the all out hammerhead or Pitts type inverted spins, so one may be less likely to need to bail out of a 34. But I could never understand the few owners who don't wear chutes in their 34s. You've go to sit on something, why not sit on something that can save your life? You can have a big cushion for your butt in case you don't eat as many donuts as I do, and have that cushion be part of the chute. Having to bail out as a civilian is rare, but I know a few people that have been saved that way, like Sean Tucker.

    For those who fly all out acro ,where a broken plane or unrecoverable spin is not unknown, a chute really is a must. For other experimental and warbird types it is a good idea. I actually feel a little uneasy sometimes because I don't wear one in the Bonanza, where there is no good way to get out the door.

    My idea on safety is that it is up to me to cut down the danger by not doing dumb stuff, like low level vertical acro, or too much scud running or imc sneaking through or takiing off with a dead mag, or going with my chute half buckled,
    For the rest of the danger spectrum ,that is up to luck or God or whatever, and that part is something we can't control all the time.
    Last edited by Bill Greenwood; 06-10-2012 at 07:03 PM.

  2. #22
    steveinindy's Avatar
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    Steve, maybe I am not the norm, but I sure don't take off my seat belt, EVER, while I am flying. And that includes when I am in a plane capable of acro , or just my Bonanza or an airliner unless I am going to the restroom. And I wear it all the time I am driving, not just on freeways or weekdays or any other bad reason.
    Sure, I may have not have it as tight as it will go all the time, and part of my landing checklist is to snug it up, but I don't unbuckle it. What purpose does that serve? I can't imagine wanting to fly along with a chute half on and half off.That would be like having fire insurance on your house that was only good for every other day.
    Yes, but you're thinking proactively. I never take my restraints off while flying either. If everyone thought that way, I'd be out of a job. It's that big "I'm too good/lucky/smart/etc....it won't happen to me" attitude among pilots creeping up again. We see it all the time on forums like this one.

    My idea on safety is that it is up to me to cut down the danger by not doing dumb stuff, like low level vertical acro, or too much scud running or imc sneaking through or takiing off with a dead mag, or going with my chute half buckled,
    For the rest of the danger spectrum ,that is up to luck or God or whatever, and that part is something we can't control all the time.
    Thank you for that. I've had too many friends whose last contribution to aviation was to be reduced to a series of numbers on a spreadsheet to track safety and injury information. I hope to never have to do it for someone I know ever again and that's why I do the work I do (to try to prevent that). We may not always see eye to eye Bill, but I do consider you a 'friend' in a way simply because you're a fellow pilot. Same goes for the rest of the motley crew on here.
    Last edited by steveinindy; 06-10-2012 at 10:27 AM.
    Unfortunately in science what you believe is irrelevant.

    "I'm an old-fashioned Southern Gentleman. Which means I can be a cast-iron son-of-a-***** when I want to be."- Robert A. Heinlein.



  3. #23

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    This topic has "deployed" my memory cells! I spent most of my 6 years in the Air Force Reserve as a Loadmaster in a Tactical Airlift unit. I packed and rigged thousands of cargo chutes for loads ranging from 500 Lbs. to small vehicles. As the GIB ("Guy in the Back"), I was required to wear a parachute which was packed by our Squadron rigger and kept on a rack with other personal equipment just down the hall from the locker room. These chutes were very well maintained and always "current". When I first started flying Air Drops I was a bit anxious walking around the open (missing) cargo door, C119G's have to leave the cargo doors on the ground. Wearing the chute was a real confidence builder when walking around the cargo compartment while the airplane bounced around the sky in formations of 9 to 13 aircraft. In addition to flying missions I did serve on recovery teams working the drop zone as well. We would just "field pack" the recovered cargo chutes then load the trucks and return to base. All these chutes were repacked the next day, each was inspected for water, bugs, and any other debris. Since we ran air drops all year long we would get some wet chutes from time to time and the big G11A's would take a few days to dry out.

    Packing Military cargo chutes is really pretty easy and you could learn the "process" in a couple of hours by just working with another GIB. These are all deployed with a "static line" as were all the chutes used by your basic airborne troopers. We did lots of support missions at the Army's jump school at Fort Benning, Ga. I've never jumped out of an airplane, but I would agree with others on this thread that having an out of date chute along would be far better then none if your having a really bad day. This equipment is very reliable, but not a 100% guarantee, only remember one airdrop injury involving a paratrooper who got a partial deployment on his main chute and pulled his reserve, then landed and broke his back. One failure in 4 years of flying and dropping thousands of troopers, is a pretty good testament for the equipment.

    Joe

  4. #24
    steveinindy's Avatar
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    We did lots of support missions at the Army's jump school at Fort Benning, Ga
    "What's Airborne training like?
    Step 1: Separate the men from the boys.
    Step 2: Separate the fools from the men.
    Step 3: The fools jump out of perfectly good airplanes."

    A joke told to me by a WWII era 101st Airborne medic that I know.
    Unfortunately in science what you believe is irrelevant.

    "I'm an old-fashioned Southern Gentleman. Which means I can be a cast-iron son-of-a-***** when I want to be."- Robert A. Heinlein.



  5. #25

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    Well, since you brought it up....

    One of my mentors as a young skydiver was a gentleman named Carl Beck. On the night of June 6, 1944, Carl and a bunch of other crazy 17 year olds, stepped out into the night sky over a French town named Ste. Mere Eglise. Three of my fellow young skydivers were grandsons of then Col, "Jumping" Jim Gavin, commander of the 82nd, who pulled his troops together and made it happen that night.

    Carl told me that in 1969 the phone rang. The guys who were there that night have a very exclusive club, and the voice on the other end of the telephone ask whether Carl wanted to jump into France on the 25 anniversary of the beginning of the liberation of France. Carl reported that the French military provided parachutes and airplanes and a bunch of them landed in St. Mere Eglise to a much warmer reception than they got that night in 1944. And the towns residents have long memories. To this day, if you were an airborne trooper that night in 1944, you can do no wrong in St. Mere Eglise.

    Carl turned into a sport jumper after that and made another 1000 sport jumps in addition to his two combat jumps and the military jump training that preceded them. He also jumped into St. Mere Eglise on the 30th and 40th anniversaries I believe.

    Not bad for a fool kid.

    Fly safe,

    Wes
    N78PS

  6. #26
    steveinindy's Avatar
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    Those guys were heroes in every since of the word. I hate to split it out, but I hold the guys who did it unarmed (the medics) in slightly higher regard.
    Unfortunately in science what you believe is irrelevant.

    "I'm an old-fashioned Southern Gentleman. Which means I can be a cast-iron son-of-a-***** when I want to be."- Robert A. Heinlein.



  7. #27

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    In answer to the question "What's Airborne training like?", I'd say it's all about motivation! The trainees run everywhere they go, from morning till night. They practice jumps off low "zip" lines and higher towers, when the training is over they make 5 jumps in 4 days from planes...these are low level, 1500MSL. The last jump is with full equipment so they're heavy and have a weapon strapped to their leg, difficult to walk around. The "Jump Master" gets them all pumped up to a point that even I wanted to go out the door with them! I used to start off the pre take-off briefing with a shout..."Sargent who are these people?!! Always got the same answer..."AIRBORNE!" followed by "HOW FAR?!", response..."ALL THE WAY"! They give 100% and many gave all they had in Viet Nam, those that completed their tour in SE Asia were assigned to the 82nd which was part of Strike Command the forerunner of the rapid deployment force based at Fort Bragg, N.C.

    Joe

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