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Thread: Parachute question (technicality)

  1. #11

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    I have 57 military jumps and I understand the matter pretty well, if you are taking your airplane and your skills to the limit, then wear the damn chute no matter what the regs say. It would of course be prudent to get it checked and re-packed and perhaps you should observe the rigger to make sure you are getting your money's worth. The old cliche "what's your life worth" is meaningless when we sell ourselves for peanuts to businesses /employers/Gov't everyday, so let me put it this way, as soon as you get time do it right. Rant over.

  2. #12

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    If you have military jumps, thank you for your service.

    That said, if you are familiar with civilian pilot emergency parachutes and their use, you will agree that they have almost nothing in common with military gear or training.

    Comparing logbooks is always interesting. I moved from skydiving into more flying, but some of my friends have log books that now record jump totals in the 5000 to 7000 range. And my military friends came home from the middle east talking about going out of the airplane at 40,000' in the dark over a hostile country with their SF team. Everyone's experience is different and some of it overlaps and some does not.

    If you fly with a pilot emergency parachute, the best advice is to get it inspected by someone who is knowlegable about the particular rig, take care of the rig between repacks, and walk through a bail out every so often. If you can make the time, stop by a drop zone and make a tandem jump. Being in an airplane on fire is not the best time to start learning about skydiving.

    Fly safe,

    Wes
    N78PS

  3. #13
    steveinindy's Avatar
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    Being in an airplane on fire is not the best time to start learning about skydiving.
    ....or at night with an engine out. Aim the plane towards somewhere dark and hope you paid attention during your jump training.

    I have quite a few jumps to my credit and four of them have been at night out of Cessnas simply for the experience in case I ever need to do it "for real" since the two primary reasons for my bailing out would be fire (or exceptionally dense smoke preventing a safe landing) or a loss of power at night outside of the traffic pattern.
    Last edited by steveinindy; 06-09-2012 at 09:22 AM.
    Unfortunately in science what you believe is irrelevant.

    "I'm an old-fashioned Southern Gentleman. Which means I can be a cast-iron son-of-a-***** when I want to be."- Robert A. Heinlein.



  4. #14

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    For years my friend Art Vance flew his Mustang without a parachute. He was a EAA member, Reno racer, and Reno check pilot, 25 year or more warbird guy. But despite lot's of suggestions, Art wanted to do it his way. He once told me, "I paid too much for my airplane, I'm never going to jump out of it."

    So one day Art is out at the airport, not even expecting to go flying and he is asked to ferry a Corsair up to northern California. The Corsair has been sitting in a hangar for a long time while it is being worked on. There is an old military chute in the seat, not even close to current, but Art puts it on.
    Along the route the engine begins to run rough, they are over wooded areas, nowhere good to land. Finally they find a strip the forrest service uses. As Art descends to land, the engine gets worse, and then it explodes into fire. Art bails out at about pattern altitude, so low that Dan Vance in another plane doesn't even see Art get out.
    The old chute opens, and as Art says with his wry and dry sense of humor: he suddenly becomes quite a fan of parachutes. One minute in the cockpit it is noisy and hot, then the next moment you are out and it is cool and quiet.
    The peaceful moment is broken as Art starts to hit the tree tops. As he put it, ""The human body is not really designed to crash through tree tops." By the time Art gets to the ground, he is much the worse for wear; suffered some burns, and generally banged up.
    BUT HE IS ALIVE, BECAUSE HE HAD A PARACHUTE AND HE USED IT.

    If you have a plane that you might need to get out of, like an acro or a warbird; and that plane is one where you can open the canopy or jettison it or the door so that you can exit easily, then carry an emergency parachute. Now it is within the FAA regs that is be repacked every 6 months, and that is the smart thing to do and to have an expert repack the chute. It will be $50 or $75 well spent, especially if you have an older chute that has not had regular inspections.
    But unless you can tread air, a chute that is somewhat out of date on repack, is going to be a lot more valueable than flying with no chute at all. Sometimes the law of gravity trumps the law of FAR. And practice, either real jumps may be important, but above all you have to carry the chute. I have not done an actual practice jump, but did go in one of the wind tunnel free float type rides. Military pilots in WW II did not do actual practice jumps and as for as I know they still don't.
    I have only a few times had FAA asked me if my chute was current, both at airshows, and they were.
    EAA does a good thing, at Osh and Lakeland both, there is a lady, Deborah who will repack your chute right there, overnight, and she is very experienced. A smart way to stay current, and she does hundreds each year.
    Last edited by Bill Greenwood; 06-09-2012 at 05:27 PM.

  5. #15

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    You much more eloquently than I made my point clear, thanks for that. Cool story too!

  6. #16

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    Bill, I think just having a parachute isn't enough. You have to be mentally and physically ready when and if the time comes. I think this is what happened (or didn't happen) in the Joe Frasca accident. He was wearing the parachute but in the heat of the moment he exited the airplane forgetting the harness was not completely fastened.

  7. #17

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    Marty, I knew Joe a little bit, though not well. His Dad Rudy is a good and long time friend. It was very sad to see how painful it was for Rudy and his family when Joe was lost. I saw Joe put on a good show in their Wildcat one year at EAA, and he had just made the U S team when lost.
    It seems hard to believe, but apparently it was Joe's normal practice to undo the chest straps when he was not competing and just going cross country.

    This original topic was about the FAR as per currency, and whether one can or should carry a chute even if out of date; and that is what my post is about. Yes, the ideal way is to be all current on practice, have it packed by a top rigger, and so on, but none of that will do you any good if you left the chute at home due to some fear of violating a FAR by being out of date, unless you can tread air. Almost all military jumps in combat or emergency situations were spur of the moment, not after actual jump practice. Just like Art's bailout and the recent one from the P-51 at Duxford?.
    Last edited by Bill Greenwood; 06-09-2012 at 09:31 PM.

  8. #18
    steveinindy's Avatar
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    Bill, I think just having a parachute isn't enough. You have to be mentally and physically ready when and if the time comes.
    I couldn't agree more. I know the first jump I made I literally had to be shoved out of the aircraft. After I was out, I was fine but as the saying goes, "Watch that first step. It's a doozie!"
    Unfortunately in science what you believe is irrelevant.

    "I'm an old-fashioned Southern Gentleman. Which means I can be a cast-iron son-of-a-***** when I want to be."- Robert A. Heinlein.



  9. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Greenwood View Post
    This original topic was about the FAR as per currency, and whether one can or should carry a chute even if out of date; and that is what my post is about.
    I researched that reg a long time ago and in reviewing interpretations, opinions and enforcement activity, nothing prohibits one from "carrying" an out of date parachute. After all, one may need to get to a place where it can be repacked. If the intent of the flight is one where parachutes must be available for emergency use, then having an out of date parachutes is an issue. I'd be interested in hearing if anything has changed since then.

  10. #20
    steveinindy's Avatar
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    It seems hard to believe, but apparently it was Joe's normal practice to undo the chest straps when he was not competing and just going cross country.
    It's not hard to believe. Look at the number of us who unbuckle our restraints during cross country flights in good weather. Same approach, at least in my book.
    Unfortunately in science what you believe is irrelevant.

    "I'm an old-fashioned Southern Gentleman. Which means I can be a cast-iron son-of-a-***** when I want to be."- Robert A. Heinlein.



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