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Thread: Diesel engines

  1. #11
    The Dec 2011 issue of Experimenter Magazine tells of a new Diesel "Flat V 8" out of Wisconsin.
    The test pilot for this engine is Dick Rutan.
    Here is the URL:
    http://www.eaa.org/experimenter/issues/1112.html

    On the Zoche engine: I believe that Mr Zoche just likes coming to OSH each summer. By displaying his engine, he can write the trip off his taxes. For 10 or 15 years now his website says that certification is just around the corner. I happened to be in the Zoche booth at OSH when Burt Rutan got down on his knees and begged Mr Zoche for two engines for his Boomerang (which was designed to use Zoche Engines). Mr Zoche said he wouldn't let any out until certification. I'm pretty sure that it will be a really chilly day in a normally hot location before the engines will be delivered for aircraft use.

  2. #12
    Mike Switzer's Avatar
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    I don't understand it, on paper the Zoche design is good - it is basically the Junkers Jumo 2 stroke in a radial configuration. The only possible issue is cold starting, why don't they bring it to production??

    My Senior design/marketing project (many years ago) included a similar (V12) 2 stroke supercharged engine design

  3. #13
    steveinindy's Avatar
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    The Dec 2011 issue of Experimenter Magazine tells of a new Diesel "Flat V 8" out of Wisconsin.
    Nice....may if this works out they will come out with a high-power version next. That is the one thing that frustrates me the most about the diesel side of the powerplant market, lots of weight for not a lot of power.

  4. #14

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    anybody else that had never heard of a flat-vee engine besides me? check this out:

    http://www.patents.com/us-7191742.html

  5. #15
    Chris In Marshfield's Avatar
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    Well, there are the SMA Engines:

    http://www.smaengines.com

    I
    f I recall, Continental entered a licensing agreement with them recently (within the last two years?).

    There is also an STC to put these engines in the C-182, albeit a spendy one. Plane & Pilot Magazine did an article on it not too long ago, so you might look in their archives.

    AvWeb/AviationConsumer also did one as well. There's a video on it as well here:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yRDJV0IMrtk

    ~
    Chris

  6. #16
    Mike Switzer's Avatar
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    OK, it has been over 20 years since I had any classes in patent law, but how in the world do you get a patent for something that has been around for at least 80 years?

  7. #17
    steveinindy's Avatar
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    Well, there are the SMA Engines:

    http://www.smaengines.com
    Yeah, there's one engine they produce and it's heavy and low-powered (assuming one uses anything but an LSA or UL engine as a standard). It's only rated for 230 hp up to 10,000 feet with a dry weight of 460 lbs. I originally had started a design around their engine when it was first talked about but then they came out with something much more lower powered than what I was expecting.

    There is also an STC to put these engines in the C-182, albeit a spendy one.
    My other alternative is a turboprop engine. Everything's "spendy".

  8. #18

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    A diesel would be good but are known to be heavy for airplanes (high compression ratios equal heavy weight).

    Zoche has been around since I displayed at OSH in '86 ... with no certification or sales.

    Thielert has been gone a while ... and the Cessna airplane that prototyped the engine is now with a local aviation training center.

    Autofuel isn't bad (beats having to heat diesel fuel/kerosene), but I agree converted automobile engines have their issues, too.

    Keep going, Steve, you'll get there!

  9. #19
    detlili's Avatar
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    Diesel Engine

    I believe that we will have a couple of Diesel Engines in the future.

    I also agree that the Zoche will never fly. I'm watching his project since 15 years and talked a couple times with him with always the same answers.
    "It will be ready and certified soon..."

    We searched also a long time for the Diesel Engine for our flight around the world. We will fly around 150,000 miles and also to remote locations where AVGAS is not available.

    Inodyne, an affordable Turbine was also on our list. They promised a fuel economy like a Lycoming but never flew below 14 Gallons on cruise.

    DeltaHawk are doing a big mistake. Instead of selling an uncertified engine first and get a lots of feedback from Experimental builder they try to certify the engine with the result of loosing years and years and from the expected price range of about $30,000 they are now in high 50th.

    In my eyes the Thielert, now Centurion is the best Diesel Engine on the market. It is a well proven engine now, with millions of cumulated flight hours and they solved a lot of problems which they had in the beginning and all the newcomer will also run into a lot of problems which must be fixed.
    But Centurion will not sell to the experimental market and the engine is very expensive.

    We ended up with a Superior engine with a "LSE Dual Lightspeed Ignition" and a fine tuned "Airflow Injection System".
    Until now we have flown about 400 hours, running 90% on 91 Octane car gas, cruising at 8,000ft with 150 TAS and burning 7 Gal running lean of peak without any problems.

    And I bet with the upcoming electronic injection system you can save another gallon. For the moment it makes no sense to me to spend lot of money in an "Alternate" Diesel Engine.

    Detlef


    Detlef Heun & Liliana Tagliamonte
    www.flight-around-the-world.org
    www.DL-Pictures.com

  10. #20
    steveinindy's Avatar
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    Autofuel isn't bad (beats having to heat diesel fuel/kerosene)
    If I'm going with a gasoline based fuel, I'd just go with 100LL until a suitable substitute is available which it should be in the next four to five years. However, the same problem exists that finding a high enough horsepower engine to achieve decent performance (especially at altitude) continues to be an issue.

    I am trying to stay away from uncertified engines simply because I may want to try to get this aircraft certified at some point (if for nothing less than to reduce insurance and to alleviate any potential issues with foreign travel in a large "experimental").

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