read on another forum that your doc will have to fill out a 36 page form (in addition) to the form you bring and that liability concerns will be taking a lot of docs out of the picture. scare tactics? not selling my LSA yet.
Printable View
read on another forum that your doc will have to fill out a 36 page form (in addition) to the form you bring and that liability concerns will be taking a lot of docs out of the picture. scare tactics? not selling my LSA yet.
Not sure where 36 pages is coming from, other than the companion AC to the rule (https://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/...ar/AC_68-1.pdf), which gives some explanation and guidance regarding the rule, is 35 pages in its entirety. Appendix A, which contains the forms you bring in and your doctor fills out, is a total of 8 pages (currently in draft and will be for a few more weeks while it goes through a procedural review; it is not expected to change at all). The doctor fills out just over 1 page worth of material.
As far as liability concerns go, you should start by talking to your doctor. You can send them the draft form from the above-linked AC (again, Appendix A is the only thing you and they will need to fill out). If they have an issue with signing the form, let us know and we will do everything we can to help you work the problem.
There is an article in this months EAA magazine on this subject of what your doctor must do or inspect in order for you to fly. When I saw " anus " I thought. I need my butt probed to fly? Really I don't need my butt probed to drive my car. This new medical reform was pushed as it being as easy to get your medical as it is to get your drivers license. Not once has any doctor stuck anything up my anus so I could drive a car, truck, motorcycle, end loader, bucket truck, Farm Tractor or semi truck. But my butt needs probed to fly a 150.
Sounds like a pain in the anus to me.
Tony
Yes, people have had a good laugh (or cry) about the "anus" item on the checklist. It's actually on the 3rd class exam too (https://www.faa.gov/about/office_org...ech/item39/et/), but the guidance is to not do the "digital exam" unless the applicant requests it, otherwise to conduct "direct observation" or review "history." I don't know about you, but my AME usually asks some vague question about it and moves on.
Similarly, the "anus" item on the BasicMed checklist has the note "not including digital examination." Unless you have, I don't know, maybe hemorrhoids so bad you can barely walk, everyone should get through this exam point pretty quickly.
While I understand all this..No one ever asked for this in 50 years of me driving my car, truck, tractor, semi, boat, jet ski, ect.. I thought this bill was started in the first place to get away from the third class medical and the requirements of this medical? To say it should be easy to get through. You should be saying we should not have to do this.
Tony
But then again I could be wrong. Maybe we have had pilots die in flight because of a hemorrhoids then kill everyone on board? My point...what is the deal with wanting to probe my anus so I can fly PP. Are they trying to prove something or maybe making a statement? What is up in my anus that will make me an unworthy pilot? That is what I am asking. Can they find something to make one not be able to get this certificate doing this or not be worthy of this certificate? If the answer is No. Then why do the test? If the answer is Yes, what is it and how does this make one not worthy? I just don't understand the reason for the test. Not trying to argue or be a smart anus...lol
Tony
Here's your chance to become informed and educated. As a male of the species I am surprised you don't know why. Getting the fickle finger of fate has NOTHING to do with your proficiency or worthiness as a pilot. But it might save your life. It's to check your prostate for cancer. It takes .0005 seconds. It is the least invasive and most reliable method of checking.
You can also have a PSA done as part of any blood work analysis but it's not as reliable so you should do both. Any man over the age of 45 should have the finger up the ass every year as part of your yearly non-pilot medical examination. Prostate cancer is the simplest cancer to detect and successfully treat if caught early enough. Talk to your doctor. Better still talk to your wife and kids, they probably would like to see you around for as long as possible.
Oh I understand why they do it. I do not understand how this can make one not worthy of a PP certificate? No one asked for this to drive ones car and no one cares if I have this when I drive my car. But they care if I want to fly a 150? Does it make one dangerous or a risk to fly? Why must this be done to fly?
Tony
Not long ago a friend of mine was busy working on Ercoupes with a man who was one of the go to guys for these airplanes. It was this man and his father who people went to for help on these airplanes. A year before his dad passes. Then a year later he passes. My buddy said he was working with him and he told him he could not shake this cold or whatever it was. His wife became ill with the flu and he thought he had this and could not shake it. Went to the doctor and a few weeks later everyone was mourning his loss. Very sad indeed. Prostate cancer took him. I believe it took his father also but not sure about that.
Tony
Sure, that's an excellent illustration of why your regular annual checkup from your doc should include screening for prostate cancer and a lot of other things. If you're over 50 or so you should get a colonoscopy every few years as well. See your dermatologist for any odd skin rashes or unusual moles, etc.
But none of that really has much to do with fitness to fly, now does it?
Ya, it does if not detected early enough and it matastisizes into lympnods, heart, lungs, brain, other major organs. Now you are a danger and at risk to fly. Peeing into the container is no different than the single digital dance. That's to look for many other medical ailments including the detection of high blood sugar(possible diabetes or type 2 diabetes). If you surpass the threshold for this, they ground you until you can lower the level. And take the colonoscopy advice from Dale, every 5 years past 45.
Not being preachy here, just offering some good overall general health management to allow you to fly for as long as possible. None of us are getting younger and nobody gets outta here alive!
After watching a couple people go through this. By the time its gone all over the body, the last thing these people are doing is thinking of going on a recreational flight. This was my point. By the time people get this far along most are not even driving. They are to sick to get out of bed or leave the house.
To say this is being done because we worry about others health is a bunch of hog wash. If we worried about peoples health so much we would not have people who become ill, then Loose their job, loss all health insurance. Then they must fight the system for another five plus years trying to get some health coverage in the forum of Social Security Disability or Medicare. Then by the time they do get some help their disease is out of control. This is how we treat those whom become ill for no reason at all. They must fight the system before they get any help. Then its to late. As the family goes broke spending every dime they have trying to pay for a medical that they can not tell you how much it will cost. We have no idea until you get the bill. Really imagine if you mechanic told you this. people would be pis#ed. But not if it medical bills.
Don't get me started on health care in America or the lack there of.
Tony
Everything on that form in the AC came straight from the AME side of the old 8500-8 and it's medexpress later incarnation.
As a prostate cancer survivor (7+ years now since completing treatment), I have to echo FF's comments. One of the things I learned from the experience is that the cancer can kill, yes, but it can also incapacitate without a whole lot of warning. Generally speaking, there aren't any symptoms of prostate cancer that the individual feels until it suddenly hits, because it has metastasized to some other organ, including possibly the brain. The thing is, there are several treatments which work very well, if it's caught soon enough. But none of those treatments work once there are metastases.
Two really good examples. I'm one of them.
Mine was caught because of a gradually elevating PSA--neither my regular doc (who is also my AME) nor my urologist could feel anything wrong with my prostate. But as FF says, usually the digital test catches it first, which is then confirmed with the PSA--but the ultimate confirmation is a relatively unpleasant taking of tiny biopsies to place under the microscope. Because mine was caught early enough, I've been cancer free for more than 7 years.
My former father-in-law is the other one. He was one of these he-man types, always healthy, who eschewed going to any doc for anything. I don't know what caused him to go to his doc; we weren't told, but it's a good guess that he, like many men in their late 50s or early 60s, was having trouble peeing due to prostate enlargement--it can be really unpleasant. But we were told that he had prostate cancer, that it was surgically removed, and that his post-surgical life was really unpleasant--had to wear Depends, couldn't have sex, etc. My guess is that it had also metastasized elsewhere, because he died 2 years later, at age 63.
Cancer knows no age limits. One of my Angel Flights was to return a couple and their little boy from Children's Hospital in Denver to their home in Hardin, MT after he had received a clean bill of health from cancer treatments--he was only 3 at the time, and his cancer had been discovered right after his 2nd birthday. The daughter of one of my acquaintances at church is now cancer free at age 6--her's was also discovered when she was 2. While I was receiving my radiation treatment, I became friends with a woman receiving radiation for breast cancer--she was only 32. One of my favorite correspondence friends died just recently at age 62--she was so upbeat throughout years of devastating treatment for cancer that had spread throughout her body, yet she always remained hopeful, a real light in anyone's life. A really good man, a former pastor at my church, fought melanoma cancer for several years before it took him at age 77, but he had ignored the symptoms (some odd moles) for too long.
Yet caught in time, most cancers can be treated, and in today's medical world, most treatments are successful. Not all, unfortunately, but the majority. Here's my video about "Catch It In Time", an organization that urges anyone with any kind of odd symptom to get it checked out--and no, the first scenes are not me! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4O6L60cXrY
So get yourself poked, prodded, even if it's pretty undignified. It's well worth it.
Cary
I have had the exams annually for several years, ever since my PSA rang the bell at an elevated number. first thing you learn is the PSA test is subject to many influences that can cause it to be higher than normal on any given test. a retest will be done to confirm or not. as you get older and prostates naturally enlarge, the PSA number can creep up, without there being any cancer present. what the docs look for are sharp spikes in the number. the digital exam is just another test used in conjunction with the PSA. in my latest annual exam (last week), the doc explained they have now incorporated an MRI scan that can give a very accurate look to see if there is anything that warrants further investigation (i.e. the biopsy). And yeah, the colonoscopy thing is a must do also......one of the most restful naps you will ever have!
Your prostate is not your anus, even if the DRE uses that avenue to measure it. It's like saying you mouth is your lung, just because the doctor has you breath through it while evaluating it.
So we all agree you need to have this done. But to make it a rule in order to get a PP certificate. Really.... I will never understand this. Someone 19 who wants this certificate must do this? Unneeded IMHO...
Back on topic, I believe it will still be easier to obtain a 3rd class medical than the new rule. With some exceptions of course and depending on ones relationship with their doctor. Time will tell and beginning in May, I suspect we'll be reading on a lot of horror stories and experiences.
The easiest avenue would be to become golf buddies with a physician. :)
It reminds me of just after Sport Pilot went active. Went to the local FBO for a biannual, and they had trouble wrapping their heads around giving me one when I didn't have a valid FAA medical. Now, they don't even blink.
Think we'll see the same thing with Basic Med. Lot of teething problems at first. Will smooth out in the long run.
Ron Wanttaja
I am sure hat the people who are smarter than I have already thought of this, but is the a repository for issues, concerns and helps for all of this? Seems it would be helpful to have a central place that receives and disseminates info...... Not the 'this is how it is going to work', but rather 'this is what I encountered and here is what I had to do'.
Rick
The reason it is on the medical is that pilots are such nice and agreeable people at all times that a doctor must check to see if one even has an anus.
;)
Hmmm, I wonder if that could bring about a restriction, much like "must wear corrective lenses," except it would say "must have a butt donut to sit on."
:)
This reminds me when I walked into the FSDO office in 2010. First mistake I made. I had no idea one was to call first. I just drove on over and walked up, to a locked door. As I stood there looking at a locked door wondering what was up with this, some dude walked up. He explained to me that after 911 offices like this are locked. He asked what it was I wanted. I told him I wanted a Sport Pilot student certificate. He asked me in and handed me off to some other dude. This dude again asks what it was I was wanting. I told him. He goes through a couple stacks of papers, looks up at me and says...I have no idea what you want could you please leave. I thanked him and walked out but not before explaining..imagine going to the DMV and finding a locked door. He just stared at me as I walked out.
My very fist experience with our local FSDO. Now everyone at the FSDO knows what and where to get a Sport Pilot Student certificate. So I do understand what you mean when you say..things will smooth out as they go along.
Tony
To quote the "Captain" from Cool Hand Luke: "What we've got here is failure to communicate"
You should visit DMV in New Mexico. Would make your FSDO look really sharp by comparison. Sometimes the doors are locked. Every time you'd swear they had never issued a license before.
Anal inspections are to check for cranial-rectumitis. Severe cases may require a view port installation in the belly button. :rollseyes:
-Cub Builder
Boy O' Boy is this the truth! When I was transferred there I had to have a NM DL and auto registration to get on the Federal reservation and they gave us up to 8 hours duty time to get a DL !
But then we were told to join AAA and get our autos registered there because getting it via the state DMV was hopeless... so I joined AAA and stayed with them the whole time I was in NM... sure wish they could help with the DL process .......:mad:
So it's absolutely true then, an alien spaceship did crash in New Mexico in 1948. And the aliens then began a ruthless reign of terror and unimagined horror by infecting a brain eating virus into all future New Mexico DMV employees both born and unborn.
my calendar shows about 4 weeks until this thing is supposed to be in effect. wonder when stuff will be published in final form.
:(Yep, then we can start trying to find doctors who WILL play the game and actually agree to do the paperwork.
The FAA really showed congress who the boss is -- with their dog-and-pony show they dreamed up to "comply" with the law.
I HOPE I'm wrong about how difficult this will be.:(
I'm too lazy to do the search to see if the Sport Pilot questionnaire is going into effect as well.
Is it?
This week I met a doctor from southern Wisconsin who is also an AME. We talked about BasicMed and he is very supportive. He will do the basicmed exams and continue with 1-3rd class medical examinations.
I plan on using my AME for this also. 3 weeks to go, should see final "soon".....
So far I've asked the last two AMEs that I've used and both said
no. My personal doctor said NO (rather loudly) so I may have to
go back and get a third class every two years ...
Congress just did not know HOW sneaky the FAA was when Congress
said that the FAA had to make the rule ...
so the F(riendly) A(viation) A(gency) made a RULE ...
'nuff said ...... :mad:
I have no idea what you're talking about by the sneaky comment. The FAA pretty much verbatim published what Congress put in the law. If you don't like the provisions of BasicMed, you should go beat on the Senator Feinstein, who was in bed with the AMA on the drivel she tacked on to the original bill.
17 days to go. sure is quiet out there. guess I'll go ahead and make appointment and hope for the best.
yipee....only 13 days to go. warming up my printer.