Hangar questions for vintage owners

Hey all,

I'm looking for some ideas regarding hangar lots, with the idea of creating an airport that draws vintage aircraft. The airport is about 20 minutes from a major city and has a 3000+' sod runway.

If you own a vintage aircraft (and would base it at a field with a sod-only runway option) could you help me with some answers to the following questions?

What is a realistic size hangar that should be planned for the lots?

Hangar homes would not be allowed by local code. That being said, I know that some individuals would still like to have a "lounge". Electric is available, but water/sewer would be expensive to run to the lots. Would not having those utilities be a dealbreaker if there was a pilot's lounge with public bathrooms?

One idea I had was to make smaller lots with two rows back to back. That way we don't price out the smaller guys, but others could buy two lots if they wanted a wider or deeper unit. The issue would be that the only access to the buildings would be from the front, and it eliminates add-ons like side windows/porches/etc. Is this an issue?

What other airport amenities would be required (a.k.a. would be worth additional costs for each lot)? Fuel is not currently available on the field, but being in a metro area it is available all around. Looking in to fuel sales, restoration companies, and encouraging existing private collections to move to the airport, but obviously some of these are "cart before the horse". As they need to be in place to draw planes, but we need aircraft in place to make them financially viable.

thanks in advance for your suggestions.

One thing to consider, some of the vintage aircraft (for instance some of the Stinsons) have a wingspan that is too wide to fit in a 40' T hangar - you might want to consider making some of the hangars a bit wider than normal.

Good point Mike. I imagine that most people wouldn't mind a few extra feet at each wingtip. If we assume a 42' door, I believe we are looking at 48'-50' wide hangar. Would ~50'wx40'd sound like a popular option? Is that too big for the cub/champ owner. Or, too small for the gullwing owner?

Make it 60' wide and allow multiple aircraft in a hangar. Most antiques, like Stinson's, Waco's, and Beechcraft are good sized aircraft. The wee classics can be fit in among them. Are you located in the snowbelt? Will you plow the runway in winter, or have everyone fly off skis, like the strip I'm based out of? 100LL is toxic to most antique engines, so a self-serve fuel farm with straight mogas, which goes for about $30K, would be the better investment. Are you planning on a septic tank and drainfield system for the public bathrooms? Why couldn't individual hangars have their own, too, if the owners wanted it? Would you allow a hangar owner to run a water line from your well or water main to his hangar? Electricity is important. If 3 phase is available, that would afford more options in the machinery and tools used in restoration work. 3000' of sod is better than a golf course. Well done!

My Navion has a wingspan of 36'. I have a 45' door on my hangar.

Hopefully you've worked out all the other land use problems with operating an airport.

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Originally Posted by crusty old aviator

Make it 60' wide and allow multiple aircraft in a hangar. Most antiques, like Stinson's, Waco's, and Beechcraft are good sized aircraft. The wee classics can be fit in among them. Are you located in the snowbelt? Will you plow the runway in winter, or have everyone fly off skis, like the strip I'm based out of? 100LL is toxic to most antique engines, so a self-serve fuel farm with straight mogas, which goes for about $30K, would be the better investment. Are you planning on a septic tank and drainfield system for the public bathrooms? Why couldn't individual hangars have their own, too, if the owners wanted it? Would you allow a hangar owner to run a water line from your well or water main to his hangar? Electricity is important. If 3 phase is available, that would afford more options in the machinery and tools used in restoration work. 3000' of sod is better than a golf course. Well done!

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60' seems a bit much, what do you guys think? Other than the Stinsons, I really haven't seen many single engine aircraft with wingspans of 40' or larger. Seems like it might be better to see if a couple guys wanted to buy 1.5 lots as opposed to pricing out a group of other owners who only need 40x40 hangars.

No snow removal, it's too much fun! Mogas (or better yet, Swift fuel) would be nice.

Yes, the pilot's lounge would have well/septic if we didn't have to provide those utilities to the hangar lots. I'm not sure how you would allow that for each hangar lot, pretty sure you'd have to run in city water/sewer.

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Originally Posted by FlyingRon

My Navion has a wingspan of 36'. I have a 45' door on my hangar.

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And it is perfect, wider than required, or too small?

What size hangar does everyone have right now? I'm in a 40' x 30' (Hatz Biplane).

More than enough probably. I have a 40' door on the Culpeper hangar I think and that's not a problem either (actually you have to watch hitting the horizontal stab on the necked down part of the T hangar before you worry about the wings hitting the sides of the door.

The hangar floor area is roughly 50x40 (again to dodge a 2000 sf limit on the building code). Non structural walls separate two storage areas and my work shop which would add another 1000sf. The open area is more than enough from for the Navion (36' wings 28' long) and my 24' tripple cockpit wooden runabout (on it's trailer) with room left over for some workbenches and shelves, a sink, the air compressor, and the dust collector for the workshop. Half a flight of stairs up to the garage also come out of that.

I've heard the "2000 sq ft" rule mentioned a couple of times. What is that? Is it a federal thing or a state code? And, what does it require if you exceed that size?

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Originally Posted by rawheels

I've heard the "2000 sq ft" rule mentioned a couple of times. What is that? Is it a federal thing or a state code? And, what does it require if you exceed that size?

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Many states adopt, in part or in whole, national codes and standards. The fire protection code adopted by Florida, and likely most other states, defines a Residential Aircraft Hangar as no more than 2,000 square feet adjacent to a dwelling. Above that, the permitting authority often will deem the hangar as a commercial building, and there will be added requirements for such things as fire protection systems, emergency lighting, additional doors, paved access to the doors from the road (driveway). In the FL code, there is nothing that requires that a hangar greater in size be deemed commercial, but it is the easy interpretation with minimum risk for the permit writer. There are hangars in my airpark (in two counties) that are over 2,000 square feet and were permitted without the commercial requirements, while others in the adjacent county are required to meet all the commercial criteria.

Your government is out to "protect" you, whether or not you want it.


BJC

Precisely. In NC 2000 sf or less you essentially have a big (residential) garage. 2000sf or more it's a commercial building. If your hangar is NOT attached to your house, you really just have some metal doors and such to deal with. If it is attached to the structure like mine, you've got bigger issues with compliance. Like I said, I have a 3000sf footprint on the hangar but I walled off (1hr firewall and solid doors) 1000' sf of it to get the hangar floor space down. Turns out to be a godsend because it gives me some storage and a shopt that are isolated from the larger hangar space. Of course, I've got a closet with a 17' ceiling, but I can deal with that.

Still looking at this project. Would love to hear any additional input from other members.

After talking with various companies, it appears that the most common stand alone hangar is 48x48x16 (44x15 door).

One more question; Which airports would be good models for this kind of project? I'm thinking something like Brodhead Wisconsin, any others?

Since you are speaking of creating multiple lots, it is worth your time to stop by the building inspector's office and see what the code really says. Each municipality can adopt parts of, but not the entire, model building code (IRC, IBC, etc.). Your locale may not have adopted any part that speaks to residential airplane hangars. If they have not, then you are not size limited into "commercial". Do not assume, check.

In my locale, I went to the building inspector and filled out the permit application. No box for "airplane hangar" on the form so I checked "Barn". Handed over a set of Erect-A-Tube blueprints with their engineer's stamp on them. 48'x48' all steel "Barn" with a 47' wide bifold door. No problem with inspections.

Now your locale may be different than mine or not. An "airplane hangar" is really just a machinery storage building with an expensive door. And if the use will be non-commercial, then you can represent that it is just a large "accessory use" building. It is in your interest to talk down the contents and speak to the lowest common denominator description.

Also check zoning. Is the real estate zoned commercial? If not, then I would use that point to say the buildings are not commercial. Can't be since zoning does not allow.

So check the details and try the easy route first.

Best of luck,

Wes