Need quick answer; Drop tanks on a warbird

[Dudley Henriques]

Hi;

I need some information please ASAP. I understand drop tanks have to be bolted on permanently and made undroppable, but can someone steer me to the exact regulation or advisory that deals with this situation?

Area of concern is whether a drop tank installation on a P51 can involve a bolted on mount (release impossible in flight) BUT the mount made so that the tanks can be removed and replaced easily on the ground. In other words, does "bolted on" mean "BOLTED ON!!!"

Many thanks for your assistance.
Dudley Henriques

[steveinindy]

I know that at least one of the P-51s out there has it set up so that the drop tanks can be replaced with fake bombs (not to be dropped obviously). If memory serves, it is the one that Jack Roush owns (owned?). I've seen it equipped with both. I don't know if this helps or not.

[Dudley Henriques]

I know that at least one of the P-51s out there has it set up so that the drop tanks can be replaced with fake bombs (not to be dropped obviously). If memory serves, it is the one that Jack Roush owns (owned?). I've seen it equipped with both. I don't know if this helps or not.

Thanks for the reply. Actually, got some input from Roush via Jim Beasley on the issue yesterday. Roush said they had to be bolted on and not dropped which I expected. What I forgot to ask was whether the tanks could be easily taken off the aircraft and put on the aircraft while on the ground. In other words do the tanks have to become a permanent part of the aircraft or are they simply made non- releasable in flight but can be removed at will on the ground.

I'm assuming they can be removed and as such are an "optional item" on the airplane. Only reason I'm perusing what should be a common sense logical answer to the question is that I've been dealing with the FAA now for fifty years and nothing in the way of illogical regulation would surprise me so I want to be sure I have it straight :-)))
DH

[steveinindy]

In other words do the tanks have to become a permanent part of the aircraft or are they simply made non- releasable in flight but can be removed at will on the ground.

Not so far as I am aware. Maybe a call to the local FSDO would settle it?

[Dudley Henriques]

Not so far as I am aware. Maybe a call to the local FSDO would settle it?

Already in the equation. No answer as yet. :-))

[Mayhemxpc]

What is your source for this requirement?

I am guessing that something similar might be required for anything mounted on a weapons pylon?

[Dudley Henriques]

What is your source for this requirement?

I am guessing that something similar might be required for anything mounted on a weapons pylon?

I'm actually seeking the source and I believe you are correct about the generality. (regulation or Advisory Circular United States)
If you find it please post it for me will you ?
Thanks
DH

[steveinindy]

I am guessing that something similar might be required for anything mounted on a weapons pylon?

I talked to a buddy of mine who works for the FSDO here. He said the "off the cuff" opinion is that so long as it is secured enough not to come off in flight, you should be okay. I called him and asked because I am kind of interested in something similar for my LSA design insofar as a couple of my biology grad student friends have suggested the idea of slinging a thermal camera or other items for tracking and counting the animals they study using me as a volunteer pilot. I went so far as including a "hard point" on each wing in the design for this purpose.

[Dudley Henriques]

I talked to a buddy of mine who works for the FSDO here. He said the "off the cuff" opinion is that so long as it is secured enough not to come off in flight, you should be okay. I called him and asked because I am kind of interested in something similar for my LSA design insofar as a couple of my biology grad student friends have suggested the idea of slinging a thermal camera or other items for tracking and counting the animals they study using me as a volunteer pilot. I went so far as including a "hard point" on each wing in the design for this purpose.

Thanks very much for your time and best of luck with your project.
DH

[steveinindy]

Thanks very much for your time and best of luck with your project.
DH

No worries. I try to be as helpful as I can be. :)

[exftrplt]

Sorry I can't give the reference, but I believe the issue is not be capable of being dropped in flight. We have removable drop tanks on our Mig-17, Mig-21 and Sabre. We sometimes fly to airshows with the tanks on, remove the tanks for the show and then put them back on for the flight home. Removable vs. droppable.
Gennaro

[Dudley Henriques]

Thank you. The way I understand it from Roush is a match for your reply. They have to be undroppable in flight but can be removed from the aircraft by ground crew.
Makes perfect sense. I'm sure this is covered somewhere by regulation or advisory. My main interest is finding this official source if possible.
DH

[Flyboy2002]

The only thing I can find is in the CFAR in the following section. But it is ambiguous as to whether or not you actually have to permanently attach items or not, or just make sure they don't fall off. Hope that helps.

§ 91.15 Dropping objects. No pilot in command of a civil aircraft may allow any object to be dropped from that aircraft in flight that creates a hazard to persons or property. However, this section does not prohibit the dropping of any object if reasonable precautions are taken to avoid injury or damage to persons or property.

[Dudley Henriques]

Thanks much. This helps a bit.
DH

[Mayhemxpc]

But it does not answer the question raised about "bolting" something on. It seems to me that keeping the safety pins in place (less the red streamers) would accomplish the same thing.

[Dudley Henriques]

Seems to answer the question. Apparently as long as the externals can't be jettisoned in flight they are legal. I'm still assuming that the tanks do not have to literally become a permanently attached "Part" of the airframe if installed.
DH

[EW439]

It is very common for warbirds that are licensed "Experimental Exhibition" to have the "bolted in place" order on the list of operating limitations.

[Dudley Henriques]

Thanks much for the input. Helpful !
DH